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EUC as skiing subtitute - Which model???


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Hello,
I will buy my first EUC and need some input like many others here but I haven´t found anyone looking for the same parameters yet.

So I would be very thankful if I could get some advice and thoughts in this matter.

About me:
Age 43 and in quite good condition haha
182 cm and 86 kg

What I´m looking for:
I ski a lot during winter (preferably powder and soft snow) and my idea is that this will be a substitute for that during summer so I´m looking for a model
that can give me as much of that skiing feeling as possible :) So the EUC is for fun and experience something new and that I can develop with. 

I live in a small village with not that much traffic so it is possible to cruise around in the center on paved roads and outside on gravel roads. It´s not that much
hills and I don´t see myself go long distances in very high speed at the moment. I also don´t think I will do tricks and so on either. What I would like is to have good acceleration
and torque, nice feeling in carving turns (if I get that good) when there is open spaces and empty roads, but also snappy acceleration and quick turns when on narrower
and curvier lanes or bicycle roads... 

One more thing that is quite important is realiability, in terms of that it should not be that much time in the workshop if possible.

I will mostly go direct from my house to the street and if I bring the EUC with me It will be in the car most of the times.

What I have looked at:
When there is no shops close to where I live, I have tried to read reviews from different people and watch movies but It´s hard to know if I analyze all info correct when
I don´t have any experience on my own before. I know what experience I want (I think ;)) as I have tried to describe and my own research have pointed out the King Song KS16-S
but there is a few new models coming out now and maybe there is better options for what I´m looking for? Or would it be better to look at 14 or 18 in wheels? Fat tiers seems
popular on newer models, will that benefit my needs? What do you think?

Ok, that´s all for me for now.

I hope you can help me out a bit :) Thank you!

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Yea, get the wheel that looks good to you. They're all great. Probably a 16 incher is the best starter size (but it doesn't have to be 16 inches).

  • Kingsong: 16S
  • Gotway: ACM2 (big battery) or Tesla
  • Inmotion: V10 or V10F (bigger battery than V10)
7 hours ago, UniVehje said:

Inmotion V8 after unlocking it to 35 km/h might work also very well.

Only if you want to die. 86kg, lighter people had overleans on a V8 (accelerating into a hill) and they didn't even unlock anything (unlocking really means disabling the absolutely necessary safety alarms).

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On 6/21/2018 at 11:12 AM, dieterGRAMS said:

If you want snappy, rollerblade like response, look into the MCM5. The ACM2 is cool aswell. I personally would pick the shorter or narrower bodied EUCs for carving under 25mph

I've skied a lots when I was younger.  The way I enjoy these EUC's is carving.  As much as I love ACM2 for performance, smoothness and the range.  One downside is the pedal height, so if the range is not the issue, the Tesla may be the better option... In pursuit of skiing feeling I've ordered MSX. ;)

Edited by Mark Lee
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Thank you guys for your input! Sorry for late replay, have been busy with holiday here in Sweden :D Most of the models you mentioning, I have looked at but they haven´t convinced me by the reviews so it´s good to get direct input from you who have experience of the wheels and can give feedback regarding my concerns :) 

Gotway: The reliability part, in general they got quite bad reputation regarding build quality but maybe it´s changing with the newer models?

V10/V10F: Definitely a contender but I had some question regarding the weight, it´s quite heavy but maybe it doesn´t effect when riding, maybe it´s good?
V10F – Had some problems in the beginning and a higher price tag (the price is not the most critical part though). With the
firmware update it sounds very interesting.
V10 – Battery.. The more battery you have, the better it is as I understand but maybe the difference between 650 Wh and 840 Wh (KS16S) don´t effects me so much?

KS18L: Also the weight and it felt maybe as a model above my level as a newbe, but probably I wouldn´t think like that… It was also the thing that 18” have the high top speed but miss a little bit of snappiness?

KS16S: The concerns that I had was actually the pedal height, it would be very irritating if they scratch the ground when carving and that it limits the feeling… Also that it is an older model (compared to the others) but that also means that it´s more reliable maybe?

When I do a quick check on the prices it looks like this, if I use the "local" Web-shops. Most of them are pre-orders.

V10 – 1400 Eur

V10F – 1690 Eur

KS18L – 1850 Eur

KS16S (840Wh) – 1375 Eur

KS16S (680Wh) – 1210 Eur

It´s hard... they all have their pros and cons I understand hmmm.

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Did you check out my last video on the video thread? That has some riding that I think resembles most skiing in forest. 

The new firmware is very promising! More info soon plus new video. 

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Gotways are fine.

You don't notice the weight of a wheel when riding.

18L can be had for 1700€ (1500 GBP at Speedy Feet).

I'd say, go with your instinct. You have very thin wheels (Inmotion), medium wide (Kingsong), and the widest stance (Gotway), so go by looks and which wheel appeals to you.

I'd say the v10(F) is good because of the pedal height and being a 16 incher (more torque/snappier), if they fix the slow aceleration.

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On 6/21/2018 at 11:59 AM, mrelwood said:

I do feel that carving was slightly more fun with the narrower 2.125” tire. On wider tires you must lean slightly over, like on a motorcycle. On 2.125” I could carve sharply both feet straight as sticks. That is the only thing I sometimes miss from the narrow tire, everything else is so much better with a 2.5” tire!

What do you mean with leaning over? 

 

On 6/24/2018 at 3:17 PM, UniVehje said:

Did you check out my last video on the video thread? That has some riding that I think resembles most skiing in forest. 

The new firmware is very promising! More info soon plus new video.

Yes I looked at it and it looks promising, will be interesting to hear about the new firmware if it fixes the acceleration and the issues Marty experienced..

On 6/24/2018 at 4:45 PM, Marty Backe said:

Any periods that drew more that 2000-watts of power resulted in him getting violent tilt-back. Very disappointing performance.

 

On 6/24/2018 at 3:29 PM, meepmeepmayer said:

18L can be had for 1700€ (1500 GBP at Speedy Feet).

I'd say, go with your instinct. You have very thin wheels (Inmotion), medium wide (Kingsong), and the widest stance (Gotway), so go by looks and which wheel appeals to you.

I'd say the v10(F) is good because of the pedal height and being a 16 incher (more torque/snappier), if they fix the slow aceleration.

The 1700 Eur deal is off as I understand... but there will be a new pre-order but it´s not specified when. So it´s hard to find the KS18L in EU/England at the moment...

 

On 6/21/2018 at 11:59 AM, mrelwood said:

I do feel that carving was slightly more fun with the narrower 2.125” tire. On wider tires you must lean slightly over, like on a motorcycle. On 2.125” I could carve sharply both feet straight as sticks. That is the only thing I sometimes miss from the narrow tire, everything else is so much better with a 2.5” tire!

I like the size, pedal height and that 16 inch is more snappy and so on with the V10(F) but the issueses they have right now and the ugly handle holds me back :P if it also have a narrower stance it doesn´t feel ideal... but hey, that´s only how I image riding it :D

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If it's a deep carving feeling that you're after -- that of a hard turn in which you can feel that centrifugal force sinking satisfyingly into your feet and slinging your tilted body around in a sustained maneuver -- then you should ask yourself how fast you want to be going and/or how wide you want your carve to be, and note that wheel diameter will determine the natural range of these parameters. A smaller wheel lets you make more carves per minute, in a smaller space, at a lower speed. At the extreme, my 10" MTen3 gives me a very satisfying carving sensation at speeds between 7-9kph, which I can carry through a full 180° (or more) in a space only a few meters across. I have probably logged close to 100km carving deep figure 8's into my normal suburban driveway in the past two months because it's just so damned fun. My V10F needs at least three times as much room to sustain such a turn, and has to be going considerably faster. An even bigger wheel will require still more room and speed.

If you want an all-purpose wheel that shines for carving, I would strongly suggest the 14" category. The MCM5's reported torque makes it the likely champion of carving within that category.

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31 minutes ago, beast@tanagra said:

A smaller wheel lets you make more carves per minute, in a smaller space, at a lower speed. At the extreme, my 10" MTen3 gives me a very satisfying carving sensation at speeds between 7-9kph, which I can carry through a full 180° (or more) in a space only a few meters across. I have probably logged close to 100km carving deep figure 8's into my normal suburban driveway in the past two months because it's just so damned fun. 

Having spent most of my more recent ski trips using MNP Line ski boards/blades I would say that the MTen3 is more like ski blades than full size skis. The diameter of the wheel effects the manoeverability almost in the same way that the length of ski does.

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I have a KS16S and I haven't hit the pedals on the ground yet.

I am not sure you will want to try to mimic longer carving turns on an EUC, don't think that will relate so well.

But the feeling of short-swing turns on piste is more similar to skiing, with the pendulum moving of the hips/thighs. And the tyre compressing at the apex of the turn as you bounce into the text turn. Probably encourages more flexibility in movement of your hips and therefore that might help your skiing.

And riding offroad on a reasonably undulating and bumpy path can feel quite similar to mogul skiing, with compression of your legs into the mogul, and then extension down into the back of the mogul.

However on a ski you would normally put more weight on the outer ski to turn but on an EUC it will be the opposite, more weight on the inside leg, at least for a tight turn. And steering with your inner thigh doesn't work so well either. 

So similar but some differences. I think that mogul style compression/extension is the most similar bit and would help your skiing.

 

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4 hours ago, Kollin said:

What do you mean with leaning over?

I mean that with a wide tire you have to lean to the curve more than the unicycle is tilting. Your inner knee bends more than the other. The unicycle is more upright than you. A bit like how in motorcycle racing the rider leans very heavily into the curve.

With a narrow tire you can have the same tilt angle sideways as the wheel has. Both knees straight.

It all depends on the speed of course, but at the same speed that is the difference between a 2.125” and a 2.5”.

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If you want to do some skiing on a EUC, the best bet is with Inmotion because of the pedal height and ride feel. The V8 is a great starter wheel, and has the ability to be a very safe vehicle. I have gotten nearly 2kw out of the motor as measured by the new app without a warning sound. The good part about this vehicle is that the battery is interchangeable. So if you feel like you will be riding 40-60 miles in a day. The V8 is a great starter, that you will always have uses for even if you upgrade. The downside is the speed is limited to 20 mph, so riding in the middle of the road is tricky at times depending on your local speed limits. Does your part of the EU buy into the 20mph urban speed limit for pedestrian safety? I cannot recommend the V10 until they settle the firmware issue. It still appears to be an afterthought vehicle that the company has no idea of what to do with it yet. 

The KS16s has a little more speed and more range than the V8 and more range but less speed than the V10F. The pedal height may limit the extent of the lean for that skiing feel, but you can always twist your body to compensate for the pedal height in turns. Kingsong makes very fun and sturdy vehicles. The bluetooth speakers are great too. Not just for music, but for engine sounds if you wish.

I would look with a very interested eye to the new Gotway MCM5. Problem with Gotway is that it feels like riding an anvil. A very quick anvil, but an anvil none the less. That is not necessarily a drawback since one needs stability on a EUC. It is thrilling in other speedy ways, and used to give one the thrill of surviving a cutout at > 30mph. This appears to be changing now with complaints now coming from the breakability of the shells, not the failure of the vehicle. Many have said the tesla will suit your needs, but I would caution about how fragile the shell is and the speed above 30mph is very risky with any vehicle, this one especially, because it can do almost 40mph ungoverned in an instant. I would look for comments on the new MCM5.

IPS has pedals that are too low for a skiing feel. Its more like a conveyor belt ride.

So you have decisions. Segway has historically been a safer than safe vehicle, and the Z series promises to fulfill that as well. It may be a long time til Segway releases their vehicle especially after the Inmotion firmware snafu. I imagine that with the fatter tyre it will give more of a motocross feel than a skiing feel.

You have a wealth of opportunities and vehicles that will definitely excite and transport you to where you want to go. There is no One perfect vehicle, so jump in and get your feet wet with whatever excites your fancy. You have been given several great choices, and we are all grateful to the companies producing these matured vehicles that we love so much!

 

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21 hours ago, beast@tanagra said:

If it's a deep carving feeling that you're after -- that of a hard turn in which you can feel that centrifugal force sinking satisfyingly into your feet and slinging your tilted body around in a sustained maneuver -- then you should ask yourself how fast you want to be going and/or how wide you want your carve to be, and note that wheel diameter will determine the natural range of these parameters.

I would like to be able to do both narrower turns (not super narrow) and longer carving turns (if possible)...

On 6/26/2018 at 12:39 PM, Turner Guy said:

I am not sure you will want to try to mimic longer carving turns on an EUC, don't think that will relate so well.

...and I don´t need to mimic the skiing technics, I´m more after the feeling of it :)

I really appreciate that you guys try to describe how I can use different EUC models/sizes to get the skii feeling I´m looking for. But I realize that just
saying that I want the skii feeling ends up in very different answers because everyone relates to skiing in very different ways. So I have tried to find
some video that represents the way I would like to ride and how I see the skii feeling in riding a EUC. It wasn´t easy but in Tishawn Fahie´s video of the Z10 there  
is a part that have that I think, it´s between 15:30 and 16:30 where he have a nice flow, is very active in hes riding and that really gets me inspired :) I realize
that he is really good of course but you need to set up some goals for your self ;)
But I don´t know if the wheel it self have some part in how he rides or if it can be done with more or less any wheel and size? Will be interesting to here your
thoughts regarding this! Thanks!

 

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6 minutes ago, Kollin said:

It wasn´t easy but in Tishawn Fahie´s video of the Z10 there  is a part that have that I think, it´s between 15:30 and 16:30 where he have a nice flow, is very active in hes riding and that really gets me inspired :) I realize that he is really good of course but you need to set up some goals for your self ;)
But I don´t know if the wheel it self have some part in how he rides or if it can be done with more or less any wheel and size? Will be interesting to here your thoughts regarding this! Thanks!

What you are seeing there (IMO, since Stan is reading this topic too ? ) is how hard it is for him to do this kind of carving. He really needs to lean in to the corner to get the euc to carve because of (I presume) the wide tyre. I think you can carve with any decent euc these days, they just all require different techniques because of the way they are built (center of gravity, wheel size, wheel width, weight etc). You wil be able to do that with a Tesla, or a V10F, or a V8, or a KS16S.

In my subjective (yes yes) opinion, I wouldn't go for the V8. Since you are looking for thrills, once you get used to riding it you'll quickly be confronted with its rather low speed limit (30km/h). It is a very good wheel, very reliable, very nice design and finish, but I think you'll want something faster soon. The V10F would be the better choice if you ask me, as soon as they get the firmware sorted out that is. If you want the V10F you will need to be patient. Today it seems to have some major issues. All the other wheels talked about here I have no experience with. 

Maybe you could also check out the Rockwheel GT16. It's not the best built wheel out there (if you look at for instance the quality of the shell), and you need to order it directly from China, but it sure has some punch, and is quite sporty for a euc.

Concerning Gotway, I don't know if with their latest models you still need to be afraid of reliability. I only have one (Mten3) and didn't have any issues yet, but that's not really representative :) 

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39 minutes ago, Kollin said:

I would like to be able to do both narrower turns (not super narrow) and longer carving turns (if possible)...

On 6/26/2018 at 3:39 AM, Turner Guy said:

I am not sure you will want to try to mimic longer carving turns on an EUC, don't think that will relate so well.

...and I don´t need to mimic the skiing technics, I´m more after the feeling of it :)

I really appreciate that you guys try to describe how I can use different EUC models/sizes to get the skii feeling I´m looking for. But I realize that just
saying that I want the skii feeling ends up in very different answers because everyone relates to skiing in very different ways. So I have tried to find
some video that represents the way I would like to ride and how I see the skii feeling in riding a EUC. It wasn´t easy but in Tishawn Fahie´s video of the Z10 there  
is a part that have that I think, it´s between 15:30 and 16:30 where he have a nice flow, is very active in hes riding and that really gets me inspired :) I realize
that he is really good of course but you need to set up some goals for your self ;)
But I don´t know if the wheel it self have some part in how he rides or if it can be done with more or less any wheel and size? Will be interesting to here your
thoughts regarding this! Thanks!

Slinging a big, heavy wheel around is definitely a more physical activity, and so more challenging on that level. Just weaving it left and right won't necessarily feel like carving, though, unless you can match the speed to the angle and tilt well enough to push some outward force down into your pedals. (I have no idea what Tishawn is feeling in those shots because I have neither his skill nor that wheel.)

Simply by doing your homework and getting all of this feedback, you're kind of doomed. No matter what wheel you get, you're going to wonder what you're missing and feel like you're missing out. I love the zip-zip-caaaarve I get with my fencing foil of a 10". I'm developing a taste for the swish-swish-swoooop I can get with my broadsword of a 17". And now I'm hungering for something in between (zap-zap-sliiiice?).

Your bank account has never been so vulnerable (excluding attachments to women or narcotics). ?

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On 6/26/2018 at 8:03 AM, Kollin said:

The 1700 Eur deal is off as I understand... but there will be a new pre-order but it´s not specified when. So it´s hard to find the KS18L in EU/England at the moment...

 

It was kinda spur of the moment, but I’m so glad I ordered the 18L when I did. The black colour sold out a couple of days after. 

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Hi,

 

I did 'carving' the last 2000 km with an Inmotion V5F. Quick response to any triggering by you. Today I got the V10 F - totally different in riding - and really slow response.

I will have to learn new - for sure. But I was skiing for 15 years any free minute including summertimes on glacier - so I would recommend a whelle like the V5F. The big ones are for other cases like going up steep hills, rough country trials and so on. But this is my opinion which is definitely only made up by a couple of 1000 km's - much less than many of the writers above ?

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The V10F loosens up after 300km or 200 miles, whichever comes first. At least mine did that. Right now it kinda feels like a platform huh? If it does, have no fear, the InMotion feeling will be brought out soon enough. Its just making sure you both get off on the right foot. Lol?

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