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Few impressions after 200km on KS-18L


andress

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Few impressions after 200km on KS-18L

I got this wheel a week ago and unfortunately it was a rainy week and I had to leave for the weekend without the wheel. That means I only rode it for just over 200 km and only today I made a longer journey including some off-road.

At first I had trouble controlling the wheel as I never rode 18” or larger wheel for more than few hundred meters. I was used to Mten3 as it was my only wheel for past few weeks (previously I rode KS-14C for few thousand km). The difference is huge, it is entirely different style of riding. At first, I was so disappointed with acceleration and braking. This wheel behaves like a fully loaded cargo ship compared to mten3. :D 

But I got used to the bigger wheel and todays ride was exhilarating! If you push this wheel with your calves as well as with feet it can climb or go down any hill. I would sooner start worrying about enough traction than power. The high speed riding feels very comfortable and stable. This wheel eats up kilometers like nothing.

The wheel has generally great build quality. It feels better than my father’s Inmotion V8 in this regard. However, when unpacked one of the side cushions was already slabbing and one of the screws holding the mudguard wasn’t fastened. I could fix both things in a minute but it was disappointing none the less.

If we are already talking about bad things… The lift-up cutoff is sometimes not working well. I mean most of the time its fine but like one in ten lift ups start good but after time while lifted the wheel activates. This is very annoying as the wheels starts spinning and beeping loudly – not good when arriving home late at night… It also sometimes turns off for a split second while standing or atleast I think that is what it does - the wheel beeps and jerks a little. Fortunately cut-off functionally is disabled entirely while the wheel is in motion.

The lift-up freewheeling speed is 68 km/h while fully charged and 51 km/h while not rideable anymore due to low battery. I rode it for about 70 km on a charge today. It was mixed street/off-road ride including steep hills and I weigh 80 kg. Max speed tested 40 km/h. It has pretty loud high frequency whine but otherwise its quiet.

I did not experience tilt-back because of low battery like @Henrik Olsen maybe because I stopped riding sooner as I hate the beeps. But the tilt-back caused by approaching set top speed is gradual so I think it is well implemented. My FW version is 1.03 and there is currently update offered in the app, but I am hesitant to go trough with it.

I have not figured out how to turn the USB ports and Bluetooth speakers on without turning on the whole wheel (no second button like on KS-16) but just laying the wheel on its side while on works. There is nice effect of equalizer visualization while playing music but it does not adjust to the volume so with low volume it doesn’t work.

The wheel also turns on Bluetooth for the app and for the speakers while charging so you can check the charge level while charging from your phone. So far neither the official app or WheelLog are ready for 84V KS so they show the right voltage but wrong battery %.

In conclusion I am very glad I now own KS-18L and Mten3 as these two wheels complement each other. KS-18L is awesome long range powerful wheel for trail and fast long rides and Mten3 is the most agile tiny power house and is super fun for goofing around and technical riding (had a blast on it on singletrek).

Now some multimedia (not @Marty Backe quality but hopefully useful, I just used my phone and had to hold it in hand as I have no tripod nor selfiestick):

Trail riding

 

Low battery behavior

Weird light-photoresistor feedback loop

 

Looking down the valley I just came from

20180618_182055.thumb.jpg.5599cb6ffdc1b0725a39620a1ecc08a4.jpg
 

Dual charging while turned on

KS-18L having a rest while a boat does the work :D

 

 

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Awesome! I'm still debating between KS18L and MSX. If only KS18L have bigger battery like 1600wh then it will be the clear winner!

I'm still waiting for MSX full review. Hopefully I can order before 25% tariff take place..

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I would also love to see a bigger battery, but the wheel is already heavy so I am thinking about external solution. I would like to print a case for external battery to be put on top of the wheel under the handle and secure it with the handle. I could use more battery when needed but keep the weight down when not. I have batteries from older wheels that I could use. I just need to design the case and figure out whether I should use the the older batteries as they are with some DC-DC step converter from 67,2V to 84V (probably includes current limiting so I could connect the external battery at any time) or if I should rebuild the batteries into 20s (higher efficiency but no built in current limiting so could only connect at the same voltage as internal) . Also have to figure out the best way to connect the battery - trough the charge port or maybe directly to the board. I will have to look into this.

Anyone has experience with external batteries on newer KS?

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@andress nice! can't wait to receive mine, was so good when trying it at our NYC demo!

12 minutes ago, Kens said:

If only KS18L have bigger battery like 1600wh then it will be the clear winner!

Somewhere on the forums (can't find where now), it was said that King Song was already working on a wider shell casing for a battery config higher than 1kWh, ala KS14D-to-KS14S.

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9 minutes ago, houseofjob said:

@andress nice! can't wait to receive mine, was so good when trying it at our NYC demo!

Somewhere on the forums (can't find where now), it was said that King Song was already working on a wider shell casing for a battery config higher than 1kWh, ala KS14D-to-KS14S.

Kingsong 18XXL :lol: I would hit that!

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3 hours ago, andress said:

Few impressions after 200km on KS-18L

<snip>

I did not experience tilt-back because of low battery like @Henrik Olsen maybe because I stopped riding sooner as I hate the beeps. But the tilt-back caused by approaching set top speed is gradual so I think it is well implemented. My FW version is 1.03 and there is currently update offered in the app, but I am hesitant to go trough with it.

<snip>

Nice review. Looks like the 18L is living up to all the expectations that people were having for it.

I don't blame you about upgrading the firmware. If it isn't broken, don't do it until you've seen a few other guinea pigs upgrade theirs :)

It would be good to know if you do get the unrideable tilt-back at the two-led power level, which I assume is ~20%?

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I think I actually went all the way to one-led power level with no tiltback. Maybe Henrik was trying to go faster than the walking speed at that battery level? I guess it is not 20% as there are only 9 LEDs not 10.

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2 hours ago, andress said:

I think I actually went all the way to one-led power level with no tiltback. Maybe Henrik was trying to go faster than the walking speed at that battery level? I guess it is not 20% as there are only 9 LEDs not 10.

Interesting. He responded to a comment that I made on his YouTube channel, that implied the tilt-back still happened after he did a range test. Hopefully it's a one-off problem with his wheel.

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On 6/19/2018 at 2:01 AM, Kens said:

I'm still debating between KS18L and MSX.

I was too, so ordered both. KS18L is the best EUC around for trips from A to B, while MSX huge battery, thick tire and highest speed is best for (very) long trips in company, in city and away from it off the roads.

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2 hours ago, EZhel said:

I was too, so ordered both. KS18L is the best EUC around for trips from A to B, while MSX huge battery, thick tire and highest speed is best for (very) long trips in company, in city and away from it off the roads.

I wish I can buy both too :whistling:

Psssst~ Let me know when you'll gonna do your next heist. *wink wink

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3 minutes ago, joku said:

I wonder why so many take the quality issues with gotway so lightly. You literally have a higher chance of being injured or killed just so you can spend more time riding at higher speeds for longer distances which increases those chances. I know everyone has a different level of risk they're willing to take, but the reward doesn't seem big enough

Some folks invest a lot of their self-esteem in a brand.  When you criticize their brand, they unconsciously perceive that you're criticizing them.  Welcome to consumer culture!  

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On 6/19/2018 at 1:38 AM, andress said:

after time while lifted the wheel activates

Several owners of production KS18L have reported the same - lift sensor works for 10-15 seconds and then stops and wheel activates while still being held in air. I wonder if it's a feature, or a bug...

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1 hour ago, EZhel said:

Several owners of production KS18L have reported the same - lift sensor works for 10-15 seconds and then stops and wheel activates while still being held in air. I wonder if it's a feature, or a bug...

A firmware update was just released to fix it

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Yeah and after upgrading I have the opposite problem. Sometimes the EUC stops balancing when not lifted up. The feature is fortunately disabled when you ride but what happened to me is, it turned off while I was standing on it because I stopped at an intersection and held on to a post. So still very dangerous. I really need them to update again and do better job this time or at least add option to turn this off!

My dealer has promised to talk to KS about it. In the mean time I have to ride another unicycle. ?

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30 minutes ago, andress said:

Yeah and after upgrading I have the opposite problem. Sometimes the EUC stops balancing when not lifted up. The feature is fortunately disabled when you ride but what happened to me is, it turned off while I was standing on it because I stopped at an intersection and held on to a post. So still very dangerous. I really need them to update again and do better job this time or at least add option to turn this off!

My dealer has promised to talk to KS about it. In the mean time I have to ride another unicycle. ?

Oops.... looks like they are skipping the QC steps.

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I finally got the newest and for some stupid reason non-public beta version of the android app (1.50). Thanks to that I could re-calibrate the sensor and it seems to work now. So if you have trouble with the cut-off sensor get the beta app from your dealer or PM me.

The app also adds other support for 18L like correct battery % for 84V and not claiming it is a illegal equipment.

I have 400 km on 18L now. I tried unlocking speed over 40 km/h and it works I only did 42, but no beeping.

Also I did my first long night ride. The light is good on flat trail. It allows for high speed as you can see pretty far away. It sucks when going downhill thou. It is caused by the EUC staying level and therefore shining forward and not downward so all that was illuminated were branches three meters high :D . This is of course not 18L specific but sucks nevertheless and doesn't really have solution since staying level is fundamental part of every EUC.

 

20180625_230219.jpg

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I've been riding on 1.06 and haven't had any issues with anything so far. But as far as activating Bluetooth without turning the wheel on, this is possible if you charge the wheel. I noticed my phone automatically connecting to my KS-18l as soon as I plugged the charger in.

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On 6/26/2018 at 1:06 AM, andress said:

I finally got the newest and for some stupid reason non-public beta version of the android app (1.50). Thanks to that I could re-calibrate the sensor and it seems to work now. So if you have trouble with the cut-off sensor get the beta app from your dealer or PM me.

 

Today I also tried the Android app version 1.50 which is in the meantime already downloadable via the Kingsong official website.

http://jc.cnaite.cn/data/apk/Kingsong_Aligned.apk

(The link is copied from https://www.kingsong.com/list-30.html )

 

In addition to install the app successfully you probably will need an APK installer und you’ll get one for free from Google play store...

 

It is very nice that you can calibrate the lift up sensor which makes it work much better and it is also possible to turn it off. You can even switch off the side LED music Equalizer effects via a separate Switch in the app.

overall a nice improvement. And yes it finally supports 84v wheels. ?

 

I hope the iOS version of the new Kingsong app will be released very soon. ?

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I just got my ks-18l from eWheels and thought I'd tag on my experience. Battery came half charged, 1 charger in the box, and tire at about 30psi. I pulled the latest v1.5 Android app from the kingsong site (worrisome that it isn't in the play store). I was prompted for the permissions and enabled storage and location settings. Bluetooth speakers connected without issue, but had to restart my phone to get it to connect to the app. Once it was connected to the app I was prompted to install the latest firmware (upgrade from 1.03 to 1.06). Once upgraded, I went in to the app settings to see what the top speed limit was set to and it is hard limited to 20kph for the first 5km. A kindly British gentlemans voice would loudly request that I "Please Decelerate" when  hitting the limit. Once 5km is reached, you request a code to unlock being able to bump the top speed to 40kph.

As my previous ride is a ninebot one e+, I had been constrained to ~24kph, so the extra speed was welcome. I never felt any wobble or issue as I pushed to 39kph which was fast enough for me for the first time. I didn't feel any significant change in riding style between the two.

There is noticable ~10Khz whine when riding, which I understand to be typical of kingsong. 

Handle is a bit wobbly, but expected for a telescoping handle and is sufficient to pull it while inside. 

I've only put a few km in, but this seems to be a solid unit so far. Looking forward to putting some more miles on it in the Old Pueblo!

IMG_20180630_110221.jpg

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@andress Very nice review! Keep on reporting, please....

 

To your question:

On 6/19/2018 at 1:15 AM, andress said:

Anyone has experience with external batteries on newer KS?

I van only say that on my Ks18S you can not power on the balancing of the wheel, while it is charged!

Yes, you are able to use bluetooth and everything else, but you can not balance the wheel.

This makes in so far sense, as the Chargeport 2 cables go into the board....and from the board there are 3 cables that go to the batteries.

These 3 cables are for charging (power in) AND for powering the wheel(power out).....means you can NOT use the system to put in power....AND put out power at the same time. ...Bluetooth and so on only work while charging because they get the power from the charger....but balancing/real running the wheel would need the battery power.

This is due to security reasons with paralleled batterys.

 

So this means you can not use external batteries just by pluging them into the chargeport.

You would need to create some wires that would switch the external batteries parallel to the inside batteries.

 

Sorry if i can not explain it better.....

 

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2 hours ago, US69 said:

@andress Very nice review! Keep on reporting, please....

 

To your question:

I van only say that on my Ks18S you can not power on the balancing of the wheel, while it is charged!

Yes, you are able to use bluetooth and everything else, but you can not balance the wheel.

This makes in so far sense, as the Chargeport 2 cables go into the board....and from the board there are 3 cables that go to the batteries.

These 3 cables are for charging (power in) AND for powering the wheel(power out).....means you can NOT use the system to put in power....AND put out power at the same time. ...Bluetooth and so on only work while charging because they get the power from the charger....but balancing/real running the wheel would need the battery power.

This is due to security reasons with paralleled batterys.

 

So this means you can not use external batteries just by pluging them into the chargeport.

You would need to create some wires that would switch the external batteries parallel to the inside batteries.

 

Sorry if i can not explain it better.....

 

Given this, on the ks18l, which has 2 charging ports, in theory one could rewire one of the ports to be electrically in parallel with the batteries, allowing for an external pack, while retaining a port for charging.

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