Ando Melkonyan Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 4 hours ago, Sven said: Sounds fun! My monster is down. Unfortunately, I will have to pass group ridings until @Jason McNeil helps me with the... jerking issue. I have the same issue. What's the deal with this jerking ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sven Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 13 minutes ago, Ando Melkonyan said: I have the same issue. What's the deal with this jerking ???? Are you having this kind of jerking (or rocking)? Fast forward to 12:50 This is purely my idea: My monster's not jerking because of some kind of motor defect, but the plate(s) holding the pedal shaft had worn out. I tried tighten the nuts as hard as i can but that didn't fix it so... I'm waiting on @Jason McNeil to figure out the cause. Maybe when he's visiting CA next time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ando Melkonyan Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 @Sven Yup. exactly the same jerking/loud banding going on with my ACM. Please let me know if you figure out what its from or how to fix it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 26, 2017 Author Share Posted July 26, 2017 4 minutes ago, Sven said: Are you having this kind of jerking (or rocking)? Fast forward to 12:50 This is purely my idea: My monster's not jerking because of some kind of motor defect, but the plate(s) holding the pedal shaft had worn out. I tried tighten the nuts as hard as i can but that didn't fix it so... I'm waiting on @Jason McNeil to figure out the cause. Maybe when he's visiting CA next time. Tightening the nut applies pressure against the two wedges inside the bracket. Those wedges than apply pressure against the flats of the axle. If those wedges get worn than you have to apply some shims. It's an easy fix. And since your Monster is already apart you've done all the hard work. See this video that demonstrates the whole process: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1312011278917158/permalink/1344782942306658/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ando Melkonyan Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 @Marty Backe my hero. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sven Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 3 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: Tightening the nut applies pressure against the two wedges inside the bracket. Those wedges than apply pressure against the flats of the axle. If those wedges get worn than you have to apply some shims. It's an easy fix. And since your Monster is already apart you've done all the hard work. See this video that demonstrates the whole process: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1312011278917158/permalink/1344782942306658/ @Marty Backe Perfect. Yup this should be it. Unfortunately, i've put it back together the same night!! I wish i had a workshop in my garage... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sven Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 I spent last 2 hours tear down my monster (again), inserting the thin blade underneath the shim as instructed. But this jerking didn't go away. I really hoped this would work. I guess... i'm going to wait for @Jason McNeil to visit California.... lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 3 hours ago, Sven said: This is purely my idea: My monster's not jerking because of some kind of motor defect, but the plate(s) holding the pedal shaft had worn out. I tried tighten the nuts as hard as i can but that didn't fix it so... I'm waiting on @Jason McNeil to figure out the cause. Maybe when he's visiting CA next time. The "wedges" Marty is talking about get worn out...Unfortunatly often it does not help to apply a small Piece as it is not the nut pressure that is to low. These wedges grip against the flat axle Piece and if the form of the wedge is not any more "near enough" or lets say the same form as the flat axle, the only Thing that helps is NEW wedges. I had this defect on my Msuper...it first starts with the Shell gnarcing and then later on you get this rocking.... The design how to hold the pedalarms against the axle is not the best and known to get bad over time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sven Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 9 minutes ago, KingSong69 said: The "wedges" Marty is talking about get worn out...Unfortunatly often it does not help to apply a small Piece as it is not the nut pressure that is to low. These wedges grip against the flat axle Piece and if the form of the wedge is not any more "near enough" or lets say the same form as the flat axle, the only Thing that helps is NEW wedges. I had this defect on my Msuper...it first starts with the Shell gnarcing and then later on you get this rocking.... The design how to hold the pedalarms against the axle is not the best and known to get bad over time. So, getting a whole new set of motor will fix this! (Or just whole new monster maybe...) I'm starting to think that my monster is not worth over $2k from the fact that i have to go thru this already lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 4 minutes ago, Sven said: So, getting a whole new set of motor will fix this! (Or just whole new monster maybe...) I'm starting to think that my monster is not worth over $2k from the fact that i have to go thru this already lol :-) It are just these small pieces inside the pedal arms you need new (as far as i understand the Problem!) And Yes...it is frustrating! Really bad design on the axle/pedalarm connection Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 3 hours ago, KingSong69 said: I had this defect on my Msuper...it first starts with the Shell gnarcing and then later on you get this rocking.... This is what 1rad did fix for you? Or a different issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abinder3 Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 3 hours ago, Sven said: So, getting a whole new set of motor will fix this! (Or just whole new monster maybe...) I'm starting to think that my monster is not worth over $2k from the fact that i have to go thru this already lol Time to get a KS18. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 26, 2017 Author Share Posted July 26, 2017 7 hours ago, Sven said: So, getting a whole new set of motor will fix this! (Or just whole new monster maybe...) I'm starting to think that my monster is not worth over $2k from the fact that i have to go thru this already lol No new motor. @KingSong69 is suggesting that new wedges are needed. Are you positive that you were able to tighten the nut sufficiently? I had to clamp the pedal bracket to my workbench and use both arms to crank down on the wrench to apply enough force that the nut would no longer move. I can understand your frustration for sure. I wonder why it happened on yours but not mine (or other Monster owners). I have a feeling that some nuts are tightened at the factory as much as they should be, so they loosen faster out in the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sven Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 6 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: No new motor. @KingSong69 is suggesting that new wedges are needed. Are you positive that you were able to tighten the nut sufficiently? I had to clamp the pedal bracket to my workbench and use both arms to crank down on the wrench to apply enough force that the nut would no longer move. I can understand your frustration for sure. I wonder why it happened on yours but not mine (or other Monster owners). I have a feeling that some nuts are tightened at the factory as much as they should be, so they loosen faster out in the field. Maybe you are right, maybe it's not at its tightest point. Am I going to open it up again? unlikely. I'm not very skilled troubleshooter when it comes to DIY and the outer plastic screw holes are getting worse every time I touch it so... it might be simply the way i ride (or where i ride) But frankly, I shouldn't be doing this at all... not within the first couple of months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ando Melkonyan Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 5 hours ago, Sven said: it might be simply the way i ride (or where i ride) But frankly, I shouldn't be doing this at all... not within the first couple of months. ...see what all that "sitting down" riding did to your monster my case is not so surprising because i know i abuse the shit out of my wheel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve454 Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 6 hours ago, Sven said: But frankly, I shouldn't be doing this at all... not within the first couple of months. Is it still under warranty? If not maybe you could send it to Ewheels to be checked out, might cost a couple hundred dollars. You're right, it shouldn't be doing that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sven Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 1 hour ago, Ando Melkonyan said: ...see what all that "sitting down" riding did to your monster my case is not so surprising because i know i abuse the shit out of my wheel LOL... yeah if i was riding backward while seated, I would've felt better. (If i get this fixed) I'm going to stay away from mountain trail ridings for while and see if "where" plays a role to this loose shim/axle issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sven Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 1 hour ago, steve454 said: Is it still under warranty? If not maybe you could send it to Ewheels to be checked out, might cost a couple hundred dollars. You're right, it shouldn't be doing that. Good question. it should still be covered by ewheels' warranty. will see Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sven Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 On 7/26/2017 at 8:25 AM, Marty Backe said: No new motor. @KingSong69 is suggesting that new wedges are needed. Are you positive that you were able to tighten the nut sufficiently? I had to clamp the pedal bracket to my workbench and use both arms to crank down on the wrench to apply enough force that the nut would no longer move. I can understand your frustration for sure. I wonder why it happened on yours but not mine (or other Monster owners). I have a feeling that some nuts are tightened at the factory as much as they should be, so they loosen faster out in the field. Be aware, Monster's nuts are enormous 1" (25mm) and I've had hard time tightening them with with my wrench. My go-to sockets for EUC motors don't fit. Been searching online for the right sized oxygen sensor sockets but no luck. Wrench doesn't tight the nut all the way because the nut on mainboard side submerges. Any brilliant ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunka Hunka Burning Love Posted July 28, 2017 Share Posted July 28, 2017 @Sven Maybe take it to an E-bike shop as they might have the right tools to help you out for a repair? https://www.yelp.com/biz/electric-bikes-la-el-segundo They might have a tool that can grip onto the Monster's enormous nuts better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 28, 2017 Author Share Posted July 28, 2017 1 hour ago, Sven said: Be aware, Monster's nuts are enormous 1" (25mm) and I've had hard time tightening them with with my wrench. My go-to sockets for EUC motors don't fit. Been searching online for the right sized oxygen sensor sockets but no luck. Wrench doesn't tight the nut all the way because the nut on mainboard side submerges. Any brilliant ideas? The solution is simple if not time consuming. You have to strip the wheel down to only the motor and pedal brackets. That obviously means removing the control board and both sides of the shell. Than the nut should be accessible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ando Melkonyan Posted July 28, 2017 Share Posted July 28, 2017 I just got to the bottom of this shitty problem. One side of my pedal bracket was swinging back n forth by like 2-3 inches. Not good! Trying to think of something that'll fix this for good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunka Hunka Burning Love Posted July 28, 2017 Share Posted July 28, 2017 Are those made of aluminum? I'm no mechanical engineerologist, but wouldn't disimilar metals have different strength properties (malleability, deformation, compressive and tensile strengths) so high torque stresses would tend to deform the shape that is supposed to resist rotation unless maybe the bolts are secured super tightly? Maybe replacement pieces made of metal more similar to what the axle is made of might be a good solution. Looking at things fundamentally, with a redesigned larger axle I think that would help reduce these secondary failure points. There would be a larger flat surface area to clamp around, and maybe they could design a better way to lock the pedal supports to the axle itself. You can see by the photo that the torque stresses from the pedals have deformed the inserts allowing more play resulting in the motor jitter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 28, 2017 Author Share Posted July 28, 2017 31 minutes ago, Ando Melkonyan said: I just got to the bottom of this shitty problem. One side of my pedal bracket was swinging back n forth by like 2-3 inches. Not good! Trying to think of something that'll fix this for good. 32 minutes ago, Ando Melkonyan said: I just got to the bottom of this shitty problem. One side of my pedal bracket was swinging back n forth by like 2-3 inches. Not good! Trying to think of something that'll fix this for good. Direct evidence of the abuse that you put your wheel thru 33 minutes ago, Ando Melkonyan said: I just got to the bottom of this shitty problem. One side of my pedal bracket was swinging back n forth by like 2-3 inches. Not good! Trying to think of something that'll fix this for good. The fastest solution would be to file the 'hole' flat again and then use metal shims against the outer edge to compensate for the metal that you removed. Also order some replacements if possible for a longer term solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sven Posted July 28, 2017 Share Posted July 28, 2017 2 hours ago, Marty Backe said: The solution is simple if not time consuming. You have to strip the wheel down to only the motor and pedal brackets. That obviously means removing the control board and both sides of the shell. Than the nut should be accessible. It's not the accessibility I was talking about. I can get to the motor with my eyes closed now LOL The issue is to tighten the shaft nuts to the pedal and when you look at the mainboard side nut (when you get a chance to open yours) it's sitting inside of pedal bracket that you can hardly wrench it nor use any regular 1" sockets because of the motor cables. Last time i did this, took me 1 hour unscrew the nut and severely damaged the nut where you can't use wrench anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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