Marty Backe Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 @Jason McNeil has been out in California the last few days, re-flashing all the ACM's and MSuper's (40+ I think) before sending them back out to the customers. When I finally was able to get to his makeshift workshop with my MSuper, mine was the last one. It took about 10 minutes to open, remove the bluetooth module, plugin the Gotway firmware loader, and download the fixed code (which took maybe 5 seconds to download). This is an interesting aside. Gotway had originally told Jason that they had caught his shipment before it went out the door, and re-flashed all the boards. Fast-forward to now when Jason is re-flashing all of the wheels. The process involves taking a razor blade and slicing the silicon that is holding the Bluetooth module to the control board, so that the Bluetooth module can be removed. Jason discovered that about one third of his 40+ wheels had the silicon sliced. This means that Gotway fixed 1/3rd of Jason's wheels, shrugged, and decided to ship the rest without fixing. Who knows why. Maybe they had a deadline to meet and ran out of time, or the workers told management that everything was done so they could go home. Who knows, but it's rather amazing. I've ridden my fixed MSuper in the mountains above Los Angeles for about 45 miles between yesterday and today. Lots of fast, rough riding with bumps galore. No problems. My final test was to repeat the scenario that threw me off the wheel two weeks ago. Here's the video... Everyone who is receiving @Jason McNeil's wheels in the next week or so can rest assured that they have a solid wheel that can take abuse. I'm back to lovin my MSuper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingfelder Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 25 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: This means that Gotway fixed 1/3rd of Jason's wheels, shrugged, and decided to ship the rest without fixing. Who knows why. Maybe they had a deadline to meet and ran out of time, or the workers told management that everything was done so they could go home. Who knows, but it's rather amazing. When I worked for a company that made things in China, we had to watch them like hawks every.step.of.the.way. EVERY time. Getting caught had no effect. The potential to destroy their own income stream, one that had dramatically increased and was virtually guaranteed, had no effect. Fellow riders, remain vigilant. And do not assume Gotway has learned a thing. I would urge every distributor, as well, to approach new models and updates with no less caution tomorrow than they feel appropriate today. Because it will be entirely appropriate in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 3, 2017 Author Share Posted July 3, 2017 6 minutes ago, Dingfelder said: When I worked for a company that made things in China, we had to watch them like hawks every.step.of.the.way. EVERY time. Getting caught had no effect. The potential to destroy their own income stream, one that had dramatically increased and was virtually guaranteed, had no effect. Fellow riders, remain vigilant. And do not assume Gotway has learned a thing. I would urge every distributor, as well, to approach new models and updates with no less caution tomorrow than they feel appropriate today. Because it will be entirely appropriate in the future. I will say, that seeing the massive quantity of new control boards that they've been sending out that we can probably trust the firmware. All I can say with total confidence is that the wheels @Jason McNeil personally re-flashed are good. Everyone else will have to find their own way of getting the new control boards, and probably the wheels made in June+ are good. The last two days, for the first time I've been able to seriously ride the MSuper V3s+ and I love it. The additional power over my previous MSuper is impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingfelder Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 6 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: I will say, that seeing the massive quantity of new control boards that they've been sending out that we can probably trust the firmware. All I can say with total confidence is that the wheels @Jason McNeil personally re-flashed are good. Everyone else will have to find their own way of getting the new control boards, and probably the wheels made in June+ are good. The last two days, for the first time I've been able to seriously ride the MSuper V3s+ and I love it. The additional power over my previous MSuper is impressive. I look forward to doing the same. And at over 200 lbs and with all the steep hills around me, it's either a powerful EUC or none at all. I've got my little baby trainer, but there's no point in using that for anything but training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
em1barns Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 2 hours ago, Marty Backe said: @Jason McNeil has been out in California the last few days, re-flashing all the ACM's and MSuper's (40+ I think) before sending them back out to the customers. When I finally was able to get to his makeshift workshop with my MSuper, mine was the last one. It took about 10 minutes to open, remove the bluetooth module, plugin the Gotway firmware loader, and download the fixed code (which took maybe 5 seconds to download). This is an interesting aside. Gotway had originally told Jason that they had caught his shipment before it went out the door, and re-flashed all the boards. Fast-forward to now when Jason is re-flashing all of the wheels. The process involves taking a razor blade and slicing the silicon that is holding the Bluetooth module to the control board, so that the Bluetooth module can be removed. Jason discovered that about one third of his 40+ wheels had the silicon sliced. This means that Gotway fixed 1/3rd of Jason's wheels, shrugged, and decided to ship the rest without fixing. Who knows why. Maybe they had a deadline to meet and ran out of time, or the workers told management that everything was done so they could go home. Who knows, but it's rather amazing. I've ridden my fixed MSuper in the mountains above Los Angeles for about 45 miles between yesterday and today. Lots of fast, rough riding with bumps galore. No problems. My final test was to repeat the scenario that threw me off the wheel two weeks ago. Here's the video... Everyone who is receiving @Jason McNeil's wheels in the next week or so can rest assured that they have a solid wheel that can take abuse. I'm back to lovin my MSuper Thanks Marty for the feedback. How hard is the madden mode with the latest flashed firmware? I know that the firmware that got me to fall was really hard (loved it, close to v8), so I wonder if that changed back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 3, 2017 Author Share Posted July 3, 2017 26 minutes ago, em1barns said: Thanks Marty for the feedback. How hard is the madden mode with the latest flashed firmware? I know that the firmware that got me to fall was really hard (loved it, close to v8), so I wonder if that changed back. I don't think I've noticed any difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snurre Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 Congratulations to a good recovery for your body, spirits and wheel, Marty! And I guess one more medal to @Jason McNeil for outstanding service. That wheel can now safely stay in my "to buy" list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddylaz Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 5 hours ago, Marty Backe said: @Jason McNeil I've ridden my fixed MSuper in the mountains above Los Angeles for about 45 miles between yesterday and today. Lots of fast, rough riding with bumps galore. No problems. My final test was to repeat the scenario that threw me off the wheel two weeks ago. Here's the video... Lol I bet you padded the hell out of yourself for this particular test-run. Congrats, glad all's ok now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 Congratulations Marty! Your video will definitely provide an enhanced confidence for those waiting for their new wheels from @Jason McNeil. Jason has to be thrilled! So happy for him! Hopefully all of the existing ACM and MSuper owners out there that require firmware updates have access to either the reflash technique or are supplied new boards from their dealers. Curious, what thoughts were going through your mind as you approached the curb of death? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WARPed1701D Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 You've got some balls to recreate that scenario. I was sweating just watching it! Kudos man. Next time put the slow-mo after the regular footage. The sudden change in frame rate stressed me out as I was certain a fall was about to ensue! Expert seat of the pants riding... And film making! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Eisenman Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 7 hours ago, Marty Backe said: Lots of fast, rough riding with bumps galore. Nice video. While riding yesterday in sidewalk bumps I decided, after one bump shifted my weight very far forward, that after a certain point..... recovery from being thrown forward beyond the balance region is not likely. The motion of the Ninebot to push back under me is barely there and the feet are starting to launch the rider forward off the machine. Fortunately I stayed up on the machine. I guess in my case it becomes a question of riding style within the limits of the EUC. Good luck with the firmware update and your speedy riding style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 Congratulations, and nice follow up and info on the behind the scenes happenings! Did you get the parts to repair your ACM already, or is that still in the future? 8 hours ago, Marty Backe said: This is an interesting aside. Gotway had originally told Jason that they had caught his shipment before it went out the door, and re-flashed all the boards. Fast-forward to now when Jason is re-flashing all of the wheels. The process involves taking a razor blade and slicing the silicon that is holding the Bluetooth module to the control board, so that the Bluetooth module can be removed. Jason discovered that about one third of his 40+ wheels had the silicon sliced. This means that Gotway fixed 1/3rd of Jason's wheels, shrugged, and decided to ship the rest without fixing. Who knows why. Maybe they had a deadline to meet and ran out of time, or the workers told management that everything was done so they could go home. Who knows, but it's rather amazing. Sounds like Gotway Or apparently China altogether... @Dingfelder That development means you'll finally have your wheel soon? Nice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchet Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 Not convinced personally. This isn't something they handled well at all. They did the very extreme minimum they should do, that's it that i can see. They reluctantly allowed a reflash, gee, thx! Sorry, i don't let them off so easy, they mucked up bad. They either lied, or were incompetent, and risked user's health and lives. Glad you can enjoy the summer with your wheel Marty. Let's see if they can avoid a disaster for a few months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingfelder Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 29 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: Congratulations, and nice follow up and info on the behind the scenes happenings! Did you get the parts to repair your ACM already, or is that still in the future? Sounds like Gotway Or apparently China altogether... @Dingfelder That development means you'll finally have your wheel soon? Nice! Yup finally! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
em1barns Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 26 minutes ago, Hatchet said: They either lied, or were incompetent I wouldn't assume one excludes the other in that specific case... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwin_rm Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 9 hours ago, Marty Backe said: .......means that Gotway fixed 1/3rd of Jason's wheels, shrugged, and decided to ship the rest without fixing..... Humm.... that might be an explanation as to why my Monster (from Jason's latest shipment) appears unaffected by the oscillation bug (one Monster rider reported he was affected in the other thread). I have done some fast speed sidewalk transitions (significantly bigger bumps than the one which caused your mSuper to freak out) as well as all sorts of bumps. I've ridden it at 50 kph on the street. However, I've done about 50% of my riding in medium ride mode, 45% in soft mode, and 5% in hard mode. My hypothesis is that the firmware bug is only affecting the hard ride mode, as all the reported affected users (that either stated it or I asked them) were using that setting, combined with Gotway's constant tweaking of the mode in firmwares, but I need more data to corroborate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingfelder Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 24 minutes ago, Hatchet said: Not convinced personally. This isn't something they handled well at all. They did the very extreme minimum they should do, that's it that i can see. They reluctantly allowed a reflash, gee, thx! Sorry, i don't let them off so easy, they mucked up bad. They either lied, or were incompetent, and risked user's health and lives. Glad you can enjoy the summer with your wheel Marty. Let's see if they can avoid a disaster for a few months. Yup, their handling is a day late and a dollar short as far as I'm concerned. It did not renew my confidence in the company. The fact that they did not come out with any statement of acknowledgment, apology, and pledge to do the right thing by their customers and distributors, at least that I've seen referenced here, looks to me like rats scurrying back into darkness. Not exactly a professional comportment or one to take any pride in. It's hard to imagine improvement when there's no evidence they've acknowledged doing anything wrong or affirmed they have either any plan or intent to do better. This wheel better be one hell of a wheel and they'd better become a much more professional company, or this MSuper is the last Gotway I'll ever buy. If they don't clean up their act, all my future monies will go to one of their competitors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 45 minutes ago, edwin_rm said: However, I've done about 50% of my riding in medium ride mode, 45% in soft mode, and 5% in hard mode. My hypothesis is that the firmware bug is only affecting the hard ride mode, as all the reported affected users (that either stated it or I asked them) were using that setting, combined with Gotway's constant tweaking of the mode in firmwares, but I need more data to corroborate. There was guy who reported the oscillation bug in all ride modes. I think it's just certain (essentially random) coincidences that make the oscillation bug appear in some bumps, and maybe the ride modes influence that and the more direct, demanding "hard" mode makes it more likely to appear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Code In Space Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 What is the difference between the modes? Can you actually tell the difference when riding? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 3, 2017 Author Share Posted July 3, 2017 26 minutes ago, Code In Space said: What is the difference between the modes? Can you actually tell the difference when riding? There is a HUGE difference between the ride mores. Soft mode feels like you're riding in a car that has bad shocks, which isn't necessarily a bad thing if you want a super comfy ride (considering that our wheels don't have any kind of suspension). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 3, 2017 Author Share Posted July 3, 2017 2 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said: Congratulations, and nice follow up and info on the behind the scenes happenings! Did you get the parts to repair your ACM already, or is that still in the future? Sounds like Gotway Or apparently China altogether... @Dingfelder That development means you'll finally have your wheel soon? Nice! Along with the reprogrammer that Gotway provided Jason they sent him a box of control boards. So he was going to give me a backup MSuper control board. Instead I asked him if I could get an ACM board and he very kindly gave me one (and re-flashed it). I'm am soooo happy that he did because now I can hopefully get my ACM back on the road this week. Ian (who sold me my ACM) is still waiting for a shipment of new boards from Gotway so who knows how long it would have taken me to receive it from him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 3, 2017 Author Share Posted July 3, 2017 3 hours ago, WARPed1701D said: You've got some balls to recreate that scenario. I was sweating just watching it! Kudos man. Next time put the slow-mo after the regular footage. The sudden change in frame rate stressed me out as I was certain a fall was about to ensue! Expert seat of the pants riding... And film making! Well, hopefully most people assumed that my re-test was going to be good. You were stressed? - I was stressed making the ride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 3, 2017 Author Share Posted July 3, 2017 5 hours ago, Paddylaz said: Lol I bet you padded the hell out of yourself for this particular test-run. Congrats, glad all's ok now! Yes, and I wouldn't have done it without my new hi-end wrist guards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted July 3, 2017 Author Share Posted July 3, 2017 4 hours ago, Rehab1 said: Congratulations Marty! Your video will definitely provide an enhanced confidence for those waiting for their new wheels from @Jason McNeil. Jason has to be thrilled! So happy for him! Hopefully all of the existing ACM and MSuper owners out there that require firmware updates have access to either the reflash technique or are supplied new boards from their dealers. Curious, what thoughts were going through your mind as you approached the curb of death? Jason and I spent about 5 hours riding the local mountains (I loaned him my Monster) so we really gave the MSuper a workout. I was riding very cautiously at the beginning but by the end I was running balls out and having a blast. Confidence regained For the re-test I was slightly nervous for sure, but committed. Once you fully commit that takes the edge off of any nervousness that you might have. And all the previously riding gave me lots of confidence. I wouldn't have done it without my new wrist guards though. I'm pretty stoked to have my new wheel back. The 84 volt version of the MSuper is a noticeable improvement over the original MSuper V3 in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rehab1 Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 25 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: Jason and I spent about 5 hours riding the local mountains (I loaned him my Monster) so we really gave the MSuper a workout. I was riding very cautiously at the beginning but by the end I was running balls out and having a blast. Confidence regained That is awesome! Thanks to you and Jason for providing the confidence boost we all needed! 25 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: For the re-test I was slightly nervous for sure, but committed. Once you fully commit that takes the edge off of any nervousness that you might have. And all the previously riding gave me lots of confidence. I wouldn't have done it without my new wrist guards though. Your video speaks volumns! I saw no signs of you slowing down before encountering the infamous bump. 37 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: Along with the reprogrammer that Gotway provided Jason they sent him a box of control boards. So he was going to give me a backup MSuper control board. Instead I asked him if I could get an ACM board and he very kindly gave me one (and re-flashed it). I'm am soooo happy that he did because now I can hopefully get my ACM back on the road this week. Ian (who sold me my ACM) is still waiting for a shipment of new boards from Gotway so who knows how long it would have taken me to receive it from him. Excellent! Shortly you will have all of your wheels back online ! I need to contact @Jason McNeilimmediately before he runs out of boards! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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