KS-14C 680WH first impression

[dmethvin]

After riding more than 1800 miles on my Firewheel over the past couple of years (plus a few on the generic 14-inch blue wheel that I learned on) I decided to grab the awesome deal on the KS-14C that @KaleOsaurusRex was offering on his store closing. I was looking for something a little more portable than a 16-inch wheel so I didn't want to go for a KS-18 or a Gotway Monster! 

The KS-14C has been around a while now so you no doubt know their specs and the strengths/weaknesses as far as their numbers go. I'll just focus on my impressions of the wheel as a long-time wheel rider.

I actually got the chance to ride the KS-14C last year when @CalamityJen brought her wheel by my house for some repairs. I didn't spend a lot of time riding it but it was long enough to want one!

My first impression was that with a 680Wh battery the KS-14C wasn't much lighter than my Firewheel. Even so, it's still easier to pick up and carry since the wheel itself is smaller. The pedal design of the KS makes it easier as well because the pedal has a convenient lip that you can wrap your fingers around to get a good grip. 

From the outside the build quality seems good, but that kind of thing is hard to judge without opening up the case. That's something I plan on doing some time soon whether I have a good reason or not. When I ride the wheel and hit a bump I can hear what sounds like wires whacking against the side of the case. It's probably not a serious issue but I'd feel safer if I could secure the wires with some wire ties or tape to prevent long-term chafing or damage.

Before making the first ride I downloaded the Android app and did some setup. I disabled the first two alarms then set the third beep to 23kph and the ollie tilt-back to 26kph. The KS app is pretty generic so it's hard to know exactly which settings are best for the 14C versus other models. I figure I can bump up those alarm settings eventually but I want to be sure I'm comfortable with how it handles. Maybe it's just the ride of a 14-inch wheel but it feels faster than the Firewheel.

Comfort is definitely not as good as the 16-inch Firewheel. The KS-14C pedals are tilted slightly up at the outside, which puts pressure on the outside of the feet and makes them cramp. I'd really like to see it be flatter. Also, the surface of the pedals is ribbed a bit but otherwise pretty smooth. I am thinking about putting on grip tape or maybe sandblasting the pedals to give them a bit more grip. All that said, I took a 16-mile trip over the weekend and only had to stop a few times to rest my feet.

There's not much padding on the wheel. I don't miss it except right at my ankles which tend to rest directly against the hard plastic. So I back off just a bit by holding my feet slightly further out on the pedals. I think that might be contributing to some wobbles that I experienced at high speed. I never felt like I was losing control in those cases but it's just a bit scary when it happens the first few times. 

Now the good stuff. This wheel has great acceleration and as a 14-inch wheel it has wonderful agility. Even without much experience on it I felt more comfortable winding through crowds and maneuvering at low speeds. It also felt stable when going over rough terrain. My Firewheel has this bad habit of tilting forward when you encounter rough ground, I guess the gyro gets confused. The best way to counter it is tilting back before hitting the roughness if you see it. No such problem on the KS-14C, it was perfectly happy attacking all sorts of irregular surfaces but a good posture with bent knees is essential!

I have no idea how long this 680Wh battery will last because I can't last as long as it does. I've gotten 30 miles from the 520Wh battery on the Firewheel (I'm about 145lbs). After giving the KS-14C a charge to the 1A level using a Charge Doctor, I only drained it to 60% with a 16 mile trip according to the app. Battery capacity isn't going to be a problem, and in fact I'm wondering if I should have gone with the 340Wh to save weight!

The term "third wheel" has negative meaning in English, but I have no bad feelings for my third wheel. It's actually a fun wheel to ride! I do want to make a few small adjustments including more ankle padding, but otherwise I'm pretty happy with this wheel and would recommend it to anyone.

 

[LanghamP]

I hopped on the same deal from the same seller from the same store, but with the 840 battery version.

To be sure, it was an impulse buy and I did little research before buying it, and it's likely the axle breakages within 200 miles from people over 100kg would have dissuaded me from buying it. That said, I haven't yet had problems.

Now I already have a V5F+ with nearly 800 miles on it and a Gotway MSuper V3 1600 with about 100 miles.

I did buy a trolley from Jason McNeil which in my opinion is a must-buy with this wheel. It's too heavy to carry for any distance at all.

Compared to my Inmotion, it has about double the range but I wonder if it's because Kingsong plays fast and loose with wheel safety or whether it actually has double the capacity. Still, being able to ride much greater distances, albeit cautiously, is a godsend.

So why don't I just ride the Gotway if I want range? Simple; it's a pig.

The tiny bit extra speed is really nice; I probably go just 13-14 mph on the Inmotion but right around 15-17 on the KS. That little difference is really really nice.

I really like the wider stance of the KS.

The bluetooth speakers take some time to start up with a lot of screen thrashing, but once connected I love them. Every wheel should come with speakers.

I think I have the beeps set to 24/26/28. Now I'm not very good at gauging my speed so I'll blow through the 1st beep to the 3rd by accident, then down again but my intent is to back off once the first beeps come on.

The footpegs are odd; they sound rattly and they flex. This might be some concern.

The engine noise is certainly there. I like it as it sounds futuristic.

Going slow and doing pendulums is easy and comfortable on this wheel.

Charging takes forever! I haven't had problems because I have three wheels laying around but for those with just this wheel charging might be a concern.

The KS application is terrible; I can't update my wheel nor does it let me level adjust, and also has options not related to this wheel.

I would say this is my favorite wheel by far, but then again I haven't ridden any of the newer 14 inch KS wheels. I'm glad I bought it because by looks and by specifications I would not have bought it. Yet the wheel just gets along with me much better (but ask me again 2000 miles from now when the axle breaks).

[Dingfelder]

On 6/6/2017 at 1:45 PM, LanghamP said:

Now I already have a V5F+ with nearly 800 miles on it and a Gotway MSuper V3 1600 with about 100 miles.

...

I would say this is my favorite wheel by far, but then again I haven't ridden any of the newer 14 inch KS wheels. I'm glad I bought it because by looks and by specifications I would not have bought it. Yet the wheel just gets along with me much better (but ask me again 2000 miles from now when the axle breaks).

That's a rave review considering the competition.

I'm surprised at your calling the MSuper a "pig."

[LanghamP]

^^^^ It's a matter of appropriateness as all three wheels I have work very well. Somebody here said you cannot really know what you want until you've bought your first wheel. Wheels are in my opinion the most personal of all practical transportation devices so what seems to be minor differences on paper are really big differences when you ride them.

The Inmotion V5F+'s range is a big problem with me as I am over 100kg; it requires I leave a charger at both home and work, and am always very aware of how much range I have. I do live in a hilly place; combined with my weight that means a range of no more than 15 miles although I have made 19 miles before walking it. I do use the V5 a lot more often for shorter distances than my other two wheels as I just leave it handy, like in my car or by my doorway. The trolley of the V5 is really nice.

The Gotway is so difficult to move around. I'm always aware of the mass and sound of it. You cannot easily carry it, and trolleying it always seems to be a disaster waiting to happen. To me, the MSuper is an enthusiast wheel, for people who mostly ride the wheel and do not use it much for errands. Now I did initially have lots of problems getting the Gotway to climb hills; this was a problem with the level adjustment. I was surprised to see, after adjustment, just how raked back my Gotway was. It was really bad how tilted forward the Gotway was. The front of the wheel was perfectly perpendicular to the ground.

So that leaves the KS14c. The added range (which might just mean KS plays fast and loose with you health compared to Inmotion) means I only need to charge it up a few times per week, and somehow the KS14 just seems to sip power instead of gulping it. I don't know how to explain it any better than the KS14 seems to go faster more efficiently. 

A minor note; all my wheels seem to drift out of adjustment the same way. They all eventually tilt forward (the front of the pedal gets gradually lower than the rear). I don't really notice or care about it until I find I cannot easily climb hills, and then I have to do the level adjustment. I don't know why wheels do that but many (most?) handling problems that I've had can be resolved by the level adjustment.

I'd suggest anyone getting a new wheel do the level adjustment right away before ever riding it.

[Dingfelder]

I'll definitely do that when I get my MSuper.

I was surprised to see my ebay cheapo doesn't even have the facility to do that.  So I have no idea what to do (besides abandon it?) if it ever needs a level adjustment.

I'm surprised the KS14c works for you at your weight -- especially that you don't have to charge it much.  My reading around made me think it would be very iffy for someone 100 kg or over.

Fantastic if you're loving it, though.  A small, highly maneuverable wheel would have been my first choice if I had thought any were around to handle my needs at my weight.

[kasenutty]

I was like 240 when I got mine. I've lost 18 pounds riding it around though. We'll see how it goes, I thought it'd be broken by now. I've put hundreds of miles on it, but the app is stuck at 140 km. Has been since like the first week. 

[LanghamP]

11 minutes ago, Dingfelder said:

I'm surprised the KS14c works for you at your weight -- especially that you don't have to charge it much.  My reading around made me think it would be very iffy for someone 100 kg or over.

Fantastic if you're loving it, though.  A small, highly maneuverable wheel would have been my first choice if I had thought any were around to handle my needs at my weight.

I'm surprised with the KS14c as I thought it'd just be a second kick-around wheel instead of my go to wheel.

It IS iffy as the axel reliably breaks under 2000 miles if you're above 200 pounds.

[Dingfelder]

6 minutes ago, LanghamP said:

It IS iffy as the axel reliably breaks under 2000 miles if you're above 200 pounds.

That sounds both dangerous and potentially not repairable?  

I think I remember reading here that someone said that a machine shop could make a new axle, but someone else saying the axle was somehow intregrated with the motor in such a way that replacement was all but impossible.  I have no understanding of this stuff so maybe it got scrambled in my head.

But are you just cool with throwing it away at 2k miles or less?  Or would you try to repair it?

[kasenutty]

Can you buy a new motor? I have no idea. I thought I would learn until mine breaks and get something else. Of course I'd like to repair it if it breaks. Does anyone know how to get a new motor? 

[esaj]

1 hour ago, Dingfelder said:

I was surprised to see my ebay cheapo doesn't even have the facility to do that.  So I have no idea what to do (besides abandon it?) if it ever needs a level adjustment.

The generics have usually pins or a wires on the board that must be shorted and then it will run the calibration cycle when turned on (typically you have to lift the wheel off ground, or place it in some sort of supports to keep the tire off ground while it's level, then when it's turned on the motor turns a rotation or a couple in both directions, then it stops and beeps). But where the pins or wires are depends on the board, and there are dozens of variations of the cheap boards.

See for example here:

 

[LanghamP]

47 minutes ago, Dingfelder said:

That sounds both dangerous and potentially not repairable?  

But are you just cool with throwing it away at 2k miles or less?  Or would you try to repair it?

I believe Jason McNeil quoted me $150 for a new axel, but I don't know if that includes the motor or what not.

I'm not happy about replacing that axel. The wheel was kinda an impulse buy, but I'd rather enjoy the wheel over not riding it at all.

My calculation is I only have to ride it more than 1000 miles in order for the purchase to break even.

It costs me about 50 cents per mile to drive my car. It costs me 25 cents per mile on my EUC if it breaks at 2000 miles. Therefore I think the break even point is somewhere above 1000 and around 2500 miles if I use my KS 100% for commuting.

The unpleasant reality is that cars are ludicrously expensive to own and use, something I didn't or want to notice until I actually made the calculations.

[Dingfelder]

1 hour ago, esaj said:

The generics have usually pins or a wires on the board that must be shorted and then it will run the calibration cycle when turned on (typically you have to lift the wheel off ground, or place it in some sort of supports to keep the tire off ground while it's level, then when it's turned on the motor turns a rotation or a couple in both directions, then it stops and beeps). But where the pins or wires are depends on the board, and there are dozens of variations of the cheap boards.

See for example here:

 

Thanks.  Well out of my league, though.  (Stilsons?)

[LanghamP]

Durnit dropped the wheel twice yesterday after never dropping it for several weeks.

The first drop and scratch is psychologically painful.

 

[LanghamP]

Uuuh, today I just realized why the pedals feel so comfortable over bumps, and also rather strange. My 225 pounds or so is making the entire pedal assembly flex. As in, I can look down and visibly see the pedals flexing inward over every bump. With a creaking sound.

That cannot be good.

[dmethvin]

@LanghamP it could be that the axle clamp is coming loose. If the pedal starts to scrape the side of the motor that is the most likely cause. See the thread here: 

 

[MaxLinux]

On 6/8/2017 at 10:27 AM, Dingfelder said:

I was surprised to see my ebay cheapo doesn't even have the facility to do that [calibrate level].  So I have no idea what to do (besides abandon it?) if it ever needs a level adjustment.

 If you haven't already done so, try a Google search. I wanted to calibrate my TG T3, and at first it seemed there was no way. Eventually I found a YouTube video showing how to jump two contacts on the circuit board while supporting the wheel in a level position. I was very glad when I found that, because it made my T3 much more pleasant to ride.

[kasenutty]

Pretty sure my axle is broken. Pedal scraping. Tear down maybe this weekend

[Dingfelder]

9 minutes ago, MaxLinux said:

 If you haven't already done so, try a Google search. I wanted to calibrate my TG T3, and at first it seemed there was no way. Eventually I found a YouTube video showing how to jump two contacts on the circuit board while supporting the wheel in a level position. I was very glad when I found that, because it made my T3 much more pleasant to ride.

Thanks, but I am not competent to do any electrical fussing.  Maybe one day I could disassemble a wheel and mess with electronics, but I'm miles from there at present.

[LanghamP]

41 minutes ago, kasenutty said:

Pretty sure my axle is broken. Pedal scraping. Tear down maybe this weekend

Uh oh, you and me both. Within three days of each other.

I love my tiny wheel, I'm shedding a year right now. 

[kasenutty]

I'm crying too and I wish I was speaking figuratively ?

[Dingfelder]

2 hours ago, kasenutty said:

Pretty sure my axle is broken. Pedal scraping. Tear down maybe this weekend

Bummer for both of you.  Hope you can get it fixed.  It sounded like a big project when I read about it before. 

[kasenutty]

There's no fixing 

[Dingfelder]

1 hour ago, kasenutty said:

There's no fixing 

Ouch.  Double sorry then.  Someone before mentioned getting a machinist to make the axle etc.  But that sounded surprisingly expensive too.

[LanghamP]

16 hours ago, kasenutty said:

There's no fixing 

Your axle is broken?

[kasenutty]

Yeah man