Excitement about KS16S Sport?

[dpong]

2 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

I'm waiting for the video where she rides the damn thing 

I think you need to pay to get into the "champagne room" for that.  Not certain. 

[dpong]

While there's many a slip 'twixt cup and the lip, I have reason to believe that there will soon* be a KS16S in route to my location.  

Really looking forward to that. 

*- sure, it depends on your definition of 'soon', but I have hope. 

[Rehab1]

3 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said:

First the boob streamers on Twitch, now even EUC videos. Guess that's how you get views

@Jason McNeil should spice up his business with a similar approach....and also start selling hoverboards! 

 

 

[Marty Backe]

3 minutes ago, Rehab1 said:

@Jason McNeil should spice up his business with a similar approach....and also start selling hoverboards! 

 

 

[Carlos E Rodriguez]

OMG.  where can I get one of those!

[Rehab1]

2 minutes ago, Carlos E Rodriguez said:

OMG.  where can I get one of those!

Hoverboards? 

[dpong]

When I was a young man, in my twenties, I visited Hooters and thought the whole thing was pretty exploitive of women.  Not that I didn't enjoy it, but rather I felt a bit guilty about it.   I didn't return for decades because of that.

About 2 years ago, I was routinely going to lunch with an old friend of mine who was objectively dying. I would take him out to lunch to cheer him up, and we would have a great time.  Once I decided to take him to Hooters, because WTF.  While there, I realized something important.  It was the following.  At Hooters, the waitresses treated my friend nicely.  They paid attention to him.  Nothing was ever going to happen.  They were just kind to him.  Going to Hooters is about as innocent as it gets.  Just saying.  I feel the same about the 'hands-on' treatment of the KS16S.  

Cheessy?  Maybe.  But actionable?  Why?  All pretty darned innocent..

[Dingfelder]

I only went there once.  The chicken wings were pretty good, if a little pricey for what you got.  I felt sort of like I was obligated to either stare constantly or not stare at all, neither of which felt right.  Sex appeal was being sold pretty hard.  That felt weird and out of place in a restaurant.  Yet it wasn't a strip club either.  All in all, once was enough for me.

[Marty Backe]

7 minutes ago, dpong said:

When I was a young man, in my twenties, I visited Hooters and thought the whole thing was pretty exploitive of women.  Not that I didn't enjoy it, but rather I felt a bit guilty about it.   I didn't return for decades because of that.

About 2 years ago, I was routinely going to lunch with an old friend of mine who was objectively dying. I would take him out to lunch to cheer him up, and we would have a great time.  Once I decided to take him to Hooters, because WTF.  While there, I realized something important.  It was the following.  At Hooters, the waitresses treated my friend nicely.  They paid attention to him.  Nothing was ever going to happen.  They were just kind to him.  Going to Hooters is about as innocent as it gets.  Just saying.  I feel the same about the 'hands-on' treatment of the KS16S.  

Cheessy?  Maybe.  But actionable?  Why?  All pretty darned innocent..

I may be missing a compassion gene, but I've never thought of any women in these situations (you can add trade shows too) as being exploited. They're free people who know what they're doing and presumably are earning a fair nickel for their efforts. Miss KS16S seems happy enough to be filming these spots.

[Dingfelder]

Just now, Marty Backe said:

I may be missing a compassion gene, but I've never thought of any women in these situations (you can add trade shows too) as being exploited. They're free people who know what they're doing and presumably are earning a fair nickel for their efforts. Miss KS16S seems happy enough to be filming these spots.

They can make very good money at trade shows, and depending on the place, waitresses sometimes bring home a lot of money.  Waitress and bartender were by far the most coveted jobs for young people when I was growing up, and could be extremely hard to get.  At some really popular joints, waitresses and bartenders actually pay owners a lot to get a shift.

[dpong]

2 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

I may be missing a compassion gene, but I've never thought of any women in these situations (you can add trade shows too) as being exploited. They're free people who know what they're doing and presumably are earning a fair nickel for their efforts. Miss KS16S seems happy enough to be filming these spots.

Live and learn.  I doubt you are missing a compassion gene.  Ms. KS16S knows what she is doing, as do I, as do you.  She is having fun, as am I, as are you (I guess?)

So would my now dead friend, my best friend BTW.  Perhaps we should all lighten up.  Maybe you didn't need to lighten up, but maybe I did.  Good stuff. 

[Lukasz]

Maybe it is slightly off topic, (as recent discussion also slighly is..), but as we consider newest model here, I wonder when this solution is going to replace the wheel:

 

[Marty Backe]

56 minutes ago, Lukasz said:

Maybe it is slightly off topic, (as recent discussion also slighly is..), but as we consider newest model here, I wonder when this solution is going to replace the wheel:

 

I watched a couple short clips on Facebook yesterday. This longer version was very good.

It looks like a blast, but I can't help but think it's way too risky for me. We worry about our wheels cutting out at 20mph. What happens when this cuts out and you're 20 feet above the ground. And he's strapped into this thing. If he fell into the water he better hope that his jetski spotters get to him fast.

But there's no doubt that this looks cool.

I wonder if most people react to seeing us on our wheels as we react to seeing this guy?

[Dingfelder]

1 hour ago, Lukasz said:

Maybe it is slightly off topic, (as recent discussion also slighly is..), but as we consider newest model here, I wonder when this solution is going to replace the wheel:

 

If I saw someone on one of those, I would assume he had come to kill me.

[HermanTheGerman]

6 hours ago, esaj said:

I wanted to try different riding modes, so I set the wheel on "Riding mode" ....

It actually turns out that the Riding mode is really good (at least for me). While it ....

 

@esaj, Thanks, very interesting.

I didn't like it back then when I started with the wheel, but at this time I couldn't ride well.

Because of your words I'll try it again after 9 months now on a longer ride, let's see how it feels, I'll tell you.

Thanks for your detailed reports !

[Christoph Zens]

10 hours ago, esaj said:

It actually turns out that the Riding mode is really good (at least for me). While it isn't really soft, it clearly allows the pedals to tilt a little bit (might be more for heavier riders?). The tilting isn't especially noticeable except maybe for stronger power braking, and sometimes when crossing steeper street corner stones. Why I really like it, is that it handles the problem of getting the wheel to accelerate faster or from slower speeds in uphills, no need to clamp the shell between my legs for my lean to have more "effect". It's still also sensitive enough that I can "trim" my speed with slight movements of my ankles in addition to leaning.

I took it up a lot of hills, and then went to one of the steepest paved hills around to try it while checking the values on the app, and I could just fly up the hill. The app was giving me up to 4kW charging readings when coming down it with while braking all the time, although it might exaggerate the values. In hindsight, I should have tried starting in the middle off the hill, but I did do one go where I crawled up until the hill gets to the steepest parts and then started accelerating up to the warnings. No problems there.  The app said power used was around 900-1000W (pretty much continuously while climbing, maybe spiking higher here and there) when running up pretty steady speed, and the board temperature was closer to 40 Celsius, but it was pretty chilly otherwise too (about 8C/46F outside).

In the end, I rode about 25km, could have gone for longer but my hands were starting to feel like freezing. I didn't need to stop at all, slight discomfort in my feet at the beginning of the journey, but the last 15-20km no problems whatsoever. Don't know if it was due to the "softer but not really" -Riding mode, or if I'm just getting back to my "old self" after initial breaking in with starting to ride again.

 

 

That's good information. I will make sure to try riding in "riding mode" as well . On my Ninebot, I always had a pretty hard setting dialed in, since I got the impression from other people that you basically always want to ride as hard and stiff as possible (I'm sure @Hunka Hunka Burning Love will second that in an instant). However, it seems that a somewhat softer setting can have its advantages too. I imagine it would feel less like sliding off the pedals during a hard brake when the pedals allow for a backward tilt, giving you more grip and leverage. I'll definitely try it on the KS16S. Thanks for the input!

[esaj]

22 minutes ago, Christoph Zens said:

That's good information. I will make sure to try riding in "riding mode" as well . On my Ninebot, I always had a pretty hard setting dialed in, since I got the impression from other people that you basically always want to ride as hard and stiff as possible (I'm sure @Hunka Hunka Burning Love will second that in an instant). However, it seems that a somewhat softer setting can have its advantages too. I imagine it would feel less like sliding off the pedals during a hard brake when the pedals allow for a backward tilt, giving you more grip and leverage. I'll definitely try it on the KS16S. Thanks for the input!

I think it's a personal preference, some people might actually like the soft-modes, but generally it seems most people prefer the harder modes. The Firewheel had a soft-mode (called "comfortable mode") that was just horrible, like standing on a spring/seesaw...   It allowed the pedals to tilt a lot (or at least it felt that way) and stay tilted forwards or backwards during acceleration/deceleration, until you hit something like 25-26km/h, at which point it would "stiffen up" and keep the pedals horizontal when accelerating (but still tilting back when braking). Kinda funny that the manufacturer stated the max speed for FW was around 22km/h, yet they had firmware functions that acted only at much higher speeds   Also it felt that it reacted much slower. Allowing the pedals to tilt back somewhat during hard braking is actually nice, but I'd prefer them not to tilt forwards, at least not much and especially not at higher speeds.

[esaj]

Another nice small detail I didn't notice in the Ecodrift-pics before:

Looks like S actually measures the temperature right next to the mosfets. Probably that's an NTC-resistor, no idea of how high tolerance, but I'd think it should still give better or at least faster response to temperature rise than the ones where they use something like the gyro/accelerometer internal temperature gauge (it's there because the gyro needs to be compensated for temperature changes, but the values could be read out at least on MPU-6050), which might be located much farther away from the really hot parts.

 

 

[Christoph Zens]

38 minutes ago, esaj said:

Another nice small detail I didn't notice in the Ecodrift-pics before:

Looks like S actually measures the temperature right next to the mosfets. Probably that's an NTC-resistor, no idea of how high tolerance, but I'd think it should still give better or at least faster response to temperature rise than the ones where they use something like the gyro/accelerometer internal temperature gauge

Yes, that looks like an NTC. The silk screen marking is pretty clear as well (RTH1).

Depending on the approximation formula used, they can be plenty accurate. The simple beta algorithm typically yields a ±5°C accuracy over a 0-100°C temperature range, which is kind of OK but not that great. However, using the Steinhart-Hart equation instead, ±0.15°C over a temperature range of -50 to 150°C can be archived with an NTC.

[esaj]

After pumping the tire to a good 4 bars (about 58 psi), I tried the "Learning mode" today. It's definitely softer than "Riding mode", but not as soft as "Comfortable-mode" in Firewheel (assuming I remember right, might be that I remember it worse than it was ). I went for a 20+km ride in total, but switched back to "Riding mode" before the first full 10km. The "Learning mode"'s not so soft that it's completely unusable, but the pedals tilting slightly forward at each and every crack (and more heavily if you hit a pothole or larger irregularity on the road) is nerve wrecking. The response seems more slower, which constantly managed to surprise me, and makes me sort of "jumpy", as at times my (involuntary) reaction is almost like I'm about to fall forwards when the wheel doesn't respond straight away. Although I've known I do it, I've never paid that much attention in to how I actually use my ankles and not just leaning to control the acceleration/deceleration, especially at lower speeds, and when the wheel doesn't respond, it just sort of gets my riding "out of whack"... hard to explain, but for example when I've slowed down to a crawl in an intersection with poor visibility and check that no cars are coming, I seem to do this small acceleration just with my ankles to jump down to the crossway, and when the wheel doesn't react or reacts far less than to what I'm accustomed to, it messes up with my concentration with the traffic around me. A somewhat similar example might be if you carry boxes or something in your arms so that you don't see in front of you, and going up stairs wrongly guess where a step is... well, it's not as bad as that, but probably that helps you understand what I mean.

As the name suggests, I think "Learning mode" might be good for exactly that, learning. If you've never ridden a wheel before, it probably actually helps if the wheel isn't as fast responding and sensitive. I learned on a clone/generic wheel that wasn't really hard (but not really soft either), but I could imagine learning basic things like mounting with a powerful wheel and hard riding mode to be much more difficult, as likely the wheel would start accelerating one way or the other immediately as you lift your other foot, before you've learned to keep it level.

Personally, I think I'll stick to Riding mode for now. I could see mysel maybe using Learning mode for trying backwards riding (yeah, tried it a bit with the generic and Firewheel, but never actually learned). Also hit the tilt-back today on my way back, I've set the warnings to 25-28-30 and tiltback at 32, but sped right through the warnings into the tiltback with a faster acceleration.   It did surprise me a bit, but it still wasn't aggressive or very sudden, I just backed off and the pedals settled back to the normal position. Maybe it's done differently in the other KS's (the ones where people have said it can be aggressive/sudden, don't remember the exact models, might be firmware-version specific too).

[Tilmann]

Nice to follow along as you become friends with your new transport, @esaj. I guess, you're approaching the point, where you could even update your signature, huh? 

[Dingfelder]

1 hour ago, Tilmann said:

Nice to follow along as you become friends with your new transport, @esaj. I guess, you're approaching the point, where you could even update your signature, huh? 

Where do you even go to edit the signature?  I can't find it under Profile or anywhere else I've looked so far.

[Lukasz]

1 hour ago, esaj said:

After pumping the tire ...

Can You describe more the breaking ability of KS16S ? (in some cases I feel that breaking in KS16 is not so great) 

[Tilmann]

5 minutes ago, Dingfelder said:

Where do you even go to edit the signature?  I can't find it under Profile or anywhere else I've looked so far.

You'll find it in "Settings":

[esaj]

5 minutes ago, Dingfelder said:

Where do you even go to edit the signature?  I can't find it under Profile or anywhere else I've looked so far.

You'd expect to find it under profile, but it's not there... It's under Account Settings  -> Signature.

5 minutes ago, Lukasz said:

Can You describe more the breaking ability of KS16S ? (in some cases I feel that breaking in KS16 is not so great) 

I haven't really tried a full-blown "stop on a nickel"-emergency power braking as hard as I could, but in relatively strong power braking (where you push the wheel a bit in front of you and press down hard on your heels, and kind of "pump" the pedals backwards if necessary), it stops fast (at least with my weight). I'd say it's harder to do with the stiffer Player mode than Riding mode. You could try dropping to Riding mode (if you use Player mode) to see if it's easier there, but in general it takes some practice.