meepmeepmayer

[one more GOTWAY WARNING] ACM died on a hill (it was bad cabling + high stress, final update pg 16)

486 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

2 hours ago, Rehab1 said:

Interesting the motor wires are 16 gage.

Are you sure? From the pictures in the thread it looks like 3x1.0mm2 (17AWG)  cables to the motor from the markings on the motor cable.

*Wrong, found video, its 1,5mm2 = 16+ AWG.

Edited by Xima Lhotz
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, Xima Lhotz said:

Are you sure? From the pictures in the thread it looks like 3x1.0mm2 (17AWG)  cables to the motor from the markings on the motor cable.

They may be 17 AWG which is even worse!

I took 2 shorts videos of the so called 'Protective Heat Sleeve'. The sleeve is definitely not designed for high temperature which is troubling! 

In the first video I am cutting away the large protective sleeve covering the 3 motor wires to perform a flame test.. The 2nd video speaks volumes of the test!

 

 

3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

19 minutes ago, Rehab1 said:

They may be 17 AWG which is even worse!

All the info can be found on the motor cable something like: "3x1.0mm + 5x0,2mm2"

If it is 1.0mm2 then = 17AWG.

*Its 1,5mm2 = 16+ AWG, found a video that shows the correct information.

Edited by Xima Lhotz
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Another weak point in Gotways is under the motor cover. The other ends of those famous wires. Half of their length is not protected by individual sleeves and being held in place by a tight clamp that would cut the hot isolation as a knife. 

And I suspect there is another trio of connectors under the sleeves?

(The picture belongs to MSuper and was taken from there: http://transporteco.ru/2017/03/20/foto-otchet-po-to-1-dlya-msuper/ )

Wires inside motor.jpg

3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

3 hours ago, Rehab1 said:

I found it @meepmeepmayer. I think it was @Hunka Hunka Burning Love that said there might be a hidden screw preventing the inner shell removal.  One little screw prevented the shells for coming apart! This part of the ACM I trust!

Hope this helps if your proceed to tear into your wheel! Good luck!

 

You owe me a nickel.  6b567c5d48.jpg  Wadiditellya?  Time to update my signature line me thinks...:whistling:

Edit:  Googling the temperature of cigarette lighter flame, it shows a bit under 2000C.  Maybe another test might be to place the heat sleeve over a soldering iron tip and see how long it lasts under temperatures closer to about 200-300C?  I doubt the wires themselves are getting that hot, but at junctions like connectors or pinched areas they could be putting off some heat making their insulators less effective.  The thermal sleeving could be helping to isolate individual wires and keep the heat from adding to each other.  I'd be curious to see what @esaj thinks of my arcing theory.

Edited by Hunka Hunka Burning Love
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

Interesting cable discussion, everyone. @Radislav's picture tells me a lot of work would be required to use stronger cables, if that's even completely possible.

I'm also on @Xima Lhotz's side. Designing a wheel properly can't be that hard, can it? Looks to me they just took off-the-shelf parts they could find, and put them together like lego, without too much second thought.

@Rehab1 Congratulations on your successful treasure hunt, and interesting pictures and videos (fire video, lol). I have no plans for opening the wheel further, unless I'm deciding for a full scale "everything" operation. Maybe I'll try to separate the wires later if it does not "damage" (:rolleyes:) stuff more, and see how the motor behaves (still locked). Right now I'm being as minimally invasive as possible.

Edited by meepmeepmayer
2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, meepmeepmayer said:

<snip>

Return or repair, I'm torn. ???????????????????????????????

<snip>

Given your relative (compared to me in California) nearness to Speedfeet, I would have him repair it. I suspect the wiring would be better than the factory once Ian is finished with it.

It's rather bad luck that this happens at all (based on the hundreds/thousands which have been sold). It's rare indeed for someone to get struck by lightening twice, so you would be really safe :D

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Marty Backe said:

Given your relative (compared to me in California) nearness to Speedfeet, I would have him repair it. I suspect the wiring would be better than the factory once Ian is finished with it.

It's rather bad luck that this happens at all (based on the hundreds/thousands which have been sold). It's rare indeed for someone to get struck by lightening twice, so you would be really safe :D

Wouldn't the exact same thing happen again? It's the cables after all, not some bad connectors. What would change after a repair?

You really think bad luck was involved? My impression was the total opposite - I just did something the wheel can't do.

"statistical safety" lol

Maybe I should write Ian just with the problem description, and decide for return or repair later...

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

Wouldn't the exact same thing happen again? It's the cables after all, not some bad connectors. What would change after a repair?

You really think bad luck was involved? My impression was the total opposite - I just did something the wheel can't do.

"statistical safety" lol

Maybe I should write Ian just with the problem description, and decide for return or repair later...

You still haven't talked to Ian???  Well, I have to say at this point you have all the possible information that a person can have regarding this problem and you're just going to have to make a command decision and move forward one way or another. Good luck with your choices and hope you can get back to riding and fun soon :)

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok ok I get it, I'l write Ian first and make the decision later. Sorry if I'm stressing everyone out by going so slow:mellow:

I just don't know much about electronics, if it's my fault or the wheel's or just bad luck, all that stuff. The answers her were very helpful in getting a feel for the issue though.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

I don't think it's your fault your wheel shorted out by just riding on it.  We're not stressed.  We're just a group of passionate people who want to see your issue resolved and to help you out.  It's a great community of folks we have here with a wealth of combined knowledge and experience.  But to continue helping you, you need to help yourself to those first steps and talk with Ian to see what options he has for you. 

Edited by Hunka Hunka Burning Love
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

2 photos depicting the upper and lower mosfet banks attached to the 'so called' heat shield. In my opinion the heat sink on the ACM 1600 is nothing more than a piece of extruded aluminum. There are no fins to dissipate the heat.

Another upgrade added to my discrepancy list.

 

Edited by Rehab1
3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

@Rehab1 Your... trial and error is very helpful in getting me to decide if that's the stuff I want for myself... sorry if I'm laughing right now, if happened what the deleted posts make one think happened:D

:thumbup: You're doing the good work!

...

..... and now the post is back again? Mysteries...

Edited by meepmeepmayer
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said:

@Rehab1 Your... trial and error is very helpful in getting me to decide if that's the stuff I want for myself... sorry if I'm laughing right now, if happened what the deleted posts make one think happened:D

:thumbup: You're doing the good work!

 

I am actually having fun! This takes me back to my creative days when I had lots of time to invent and fabricate unique things. It sucks your wheel is currently broken:crying: Hopefully something positive will come out of this ordeal. :) Hang in there!

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Rehab1 said:

2 photos depicting the upper and lower mosfet banks attached to the 'so called' heat shield. In my opinion the heat sink on the ACM 1600 is nothing more than a piece of extruded aluminum. There are no fins to dissipate the heat.

Another upgrade added to my discrepancy list.

 

This is cool, but My God, you are really going at, disassembling your wheel to the extreme. Next you're going to be resoldering the mosfets ;)  And this from someone that hasn't actually had any problems. I got to hand it to you, but my mind is not into doing this kind of stuff (at least right now). I watch with fascination (and distance)  all of you guys :thumbup:

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Rehab1 said:

I found some heat sink FINS!

Interesting piece of engineering. Upon further disassembly I located 12 milled fins on the bottom of the extruded aluminum that is used to support the circuit board and Mosfets. The fins strategically fit into an opening molded into the case allowing the heat to be vented outside the enclosure towards the wheel. The wheel  acts as a fan to further dispense the heat as it spins. 

Feeling a bit better!:)

 

That part I did know about from older posts somewhere. Glad you're feeling better.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How difficult is it to replace wires into the motor?

I think that some wire maybe a little damaged when bending, so it cannot carry the amp it said to be able to carry which is already low even it is not damaged.

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now