meepmeepmayer Posted January 28, 2017 Author Share Posted January 28, 2017 2 minutes ago, Mono said: If it doesn't provide accurate voltage readings it is a little mysterious how it could provide accurate battery levels. AFAIK, and please correct me if I am wrong, battery percentage displays are solely based on voltage readings. The wheellog app gives better readings (2 digits) than the different GW apps (10% intervals, how dumb!) and they seems to match the GW readings, so I think it's trustworthy. No idea of the technical details though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 8 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: Yep I didn't want to write on the weekend. I already ordered last Saturday morning and they shipped on Sunday - felt bad about this. So this time I'll wait til monday. I have to empty the batteries tomorrow anyways to see if the charge goes higher when I charge then. I was just worried about taking the wheel outside (and scratching it up and dirt and road salt etc) until I know there's no problem and I won't have to send it back. Right now I'm wobbling through the house (great motivator - don't break any glass and furniture) and outside can wait another day... Question: is the uppermost LED in multiple parts? When I was at 70% it was off, now at 80 it looks like the lower half is lit and the upper half is off. Is there an upper half that can be on? It's hard to see in the picture but the other LEDs are "fuller" than the uppermost. These LEDs are On or Off. I know my experience is just one data point, but I've owned 3 ACMs and the LEDs all behave the same (on or off), and never have had charging issues. One advantage of owning multiple wheels is that you have multiple chargers that you can swap if you think one is causing a problem. Maybe you should order another wheel I would still e-mail Ian. It's not like your e-mail will cause him to stop whatever he's doing (enjoying life, etc.). But it'll be there when he is working. Maybe he takes Mondays and Tuesdays off and works through the weekend? Who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 10 minutes ago, Mono said: If it doesn't provide accurate voltage readings it is a little mysterious how it could provide accurate battery levels. AFAIK, and please correct me if I am wrong, battery percentage displays are solely based on voltage readings. The Wheellog app is connecting to the wheel bluetooth and reading the telemetry that Gotway continuously streams. I suspect that it streams voltage, current, and battery levels separately. That's why my 84v and 67v wheels display the battery level perfectly but the voltages are wrong for the 84v models. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 2 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said: no multimeter, charge doctor or anything else. Maybe I should get one, if only out of curiosity. The charge doctor is quite practical. If you have one with two inputs, you can use two chargers at the same time to charge faster. And you can prevent from charging up to 100%, which is good for battery life. There are not a lot of reasons to not have one for a wheel which was more than 1000 bugs bucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted January 28, 2017 Author Share Posted January 28, 2017 8 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: These LEDs are On or Off. I know my experience is just one data point, but I've owned 3 ACMs and the LEDs all behave the same (on or off), and never have had charging issues. Ok good, thanks. 8 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: Maybe you should order another wheel ACM 1600 or monster? Maybe both... 8 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: I would still e-mail Ian. It's not like your e-mail will cause him to stop whatever he's doing (enjoying life, etc.). But it'll be there when he is working. Maybe he takes Mondays and Tuesdays off and works through the weekend? Who knows. I think it's distracting when work is looming in the background. Maybe I'll write tommorow if he usually works Sunday, you have a point. First is one more charge and seeing how the % turns out. @Mono 1000 bugs? The wheel seems perfectly fine from all I've seen. I'm surprised there are no quality issues with GW after seeing the factory, so their wheels seem well designed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 30 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: Btw, the batteries' charge cycles, are they counted in time/% (so charging from 20 to 70 would be half a cycle) That's exactly how it works. Quote or are they counted "how often was the charger plugged in and charged at least a bit" (like planes, every flight is one cycle due to air pressure hull stress, regardless if it's a 1 hour or 15 hour flight)? That is not how it works with Li-Ion batteries and that's why you should better charge often a little than cycle through the entire range and charge once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 1 minute ago, meepmeepmayer said: <snip> @Mono 1000 bugs? The wheel seems perfectly fine from all I've seen. Where it really counts Gotway delivers. But they really miss the boat in the fine details. Crappy app Fit and finish leaves a lot to be desired Quality control depends on the day of the week that it was made Cheap components Poor manufacturing design etc The Chinese are capable of making great products (Apple, etc) when the design and production is overseen by western entities (Apple, etc). But when left to themselves (Gotway, etc) they produce like the Japanese did in the 60's and 70's. There is no non-Chinese competition for EUCs (at the Gotway performance level) so we get what we get. I love the performance that I get from Gotway so I have no choice but to buy their wheels. But I really wish they had some competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 2 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said: @Mono 1000 bugs? The wheel seems perfectly fine from all I've seen. I'm surprised there are no quality issues with GW after seeing the factory, so their wheels seem well designed. When I wrote 1000 bugs, I meant bugs bucks in the sense of $, dollars or euros, sorry for the confusion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 37 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: @KingSong69 I didn't mean 0% empty (I know that's bad), just maybe 50% so I see if a new charge makes a difference in the max % I get. Btw, the batteries' charge cycles, are they counted in time/% (so charging from 20 to 70 would be half a cycle) or are they counted "how often was the charger plugged in and charged at least a bit" (like planes, every flight is one cycle due to air pressure hull stress, regardless if it's a 1 hour or 15 hour flight)? Aaah, ok, understand that wrong ;-) 20-70 is normally mean as half cycle! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted January 28, 2017 Author Share Posted January 28, 2017 20 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: Where it really counts Gotway delivers. Yep. 20 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: But they really miss the boat in the fine details. Yep. I can't fully agree with the other points - fit and finish seems perfectly fine, and how would one know about cheap components? The app is indeed pure crap. And I have to add, they have nobody who speaks English good enough to communicate reasonably well with English speakers - how strange is that! @Mono Oh, bucks I was worried there for a moment. -- Would anybody have a link to a charge doctor? Amazon or whatever. I'm not sure what exactly I'm looking for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 45 minutes ago, Marty Backe said: There is no non-Chinese competition for EUCs (at the Gotway performance level) so we get what we get. I love the performance that I get from Gotway so I have no choice but to buy their wheels. But I really wish they had some competition. before the ACM i think it was KS was some steps ahead, with the ks14 and new ks16... I am really, really looking forward to the new KS18, which is in tests now! when even some of the rumours are true, and they bring the same technical progress they bring in the new ks16s and also the build quality of ks14d....they will be ahead GW again! because qualitywise, craftmansship they beat GW all day long.... there is just this little, little performancestep missing, bringing their wheels to the same speed as Gw, lets say max 50kmh...and i dont mean this because max speed...i mean it because more safety and reserve on cruising level 35kmh. we speak again in 2 months :-) hopefully..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 13 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: Yep. Yep. I can't fully agree with the other points - fit and finish seems perfectly fine, and how would one know about cheap components? The app is indeed pure crap. And I have to add, they have nobody who speaks English good enough to communicate reasonably well with English speakers - how strange is that! @Mono Oh, bucks I was worried there for a moment. -- Would anybody have a link to a charge doctor? Amazon or whatever. I'm not sure what exactly I'm looking for. yep...anybody has: http://hobby16.neowp.fr/buy/ buy the one with the 2 inputs! than you can get another cheap standard charger later and load with 3 amps ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted January 28, 2017 Author Share Posted January 28, 2017 @KingSong69 Thank you once again! I assume the 84V msuper V3 is the right one? What would be the difference to the IPS one above it, it also has two 4 pole connectors. Can this thing damage the wheel? What would happen if you connected the "wrong" one (if there's a wrong one)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 33 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: I can't fully agree with the other points - fit and finish seems perfectly fine, and how would one know about cheap components? The app is indeed pure crap. And I have to add, they have nobody who speaks English good enough to communicate reasonably well with English speakers - how strange is that! Edges are usually rough (you can cut yourself if not careful), crappy screws often not driven in at the correct angle (two identical screws on my Monster sticking out of the case because they don't fit the hole), on the MSuper the very thin covers above the pedal area are coming loose - not just on mine. I could continue... Have you seen pictures of the insides of the wheels? Kind of scary. The paint/finish on their wheels can come off - not quality. The screws that they use are awful. These are all little details that I notice. I'm a detail kind of guy - labels that are applied sloppily drive me nuts - it's problem I have, I know I agree with @KingSong69, KingSong is a higher quality component company. My KS14C seems much better built. But they just don't have the performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 22 minutes ago, KingSong69 said: before the ACM i think it was KS was some steps ahead, with the ks14 and new ks16... I am really, really looking forward to the new KS18, which is in tests now, when even some of the rumours are true, and they bring the same technical progress they bring in the new ks16s and the build quality of ks14d....they will be ahead GW because qualitywise, craftmansship they beat GW all day long.... there is just this little, little performancestep missing, bringing their wheels to the same speed as Gw, lets say max 50kmh...and i dont mean this because max speed...i mean it because more safety and reserve on cruising level 35kmh. we speak again in 2 months :-) hopefully..... I agree. It would be cool if they actually produce some ACM killers. But for me I need power and battery capacity. So hopefully they have a good showing in 2017. But, MUST, NOT, BUY, ANY, MORE, WHEELS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted January 28, 2017 Author Share Posted January 28, 2017 @Marty Backe You should start your own used wheels shop at this point, then you can try all new models... the nice and shiny new models, all of them... so nice and shiny and exciting... like the ACM 1600 Wh... have you ordered yours yet? My ACM looks fine so I could not follow you. Sad to hear you have issues with how your GWs are built. I hope it's only superficial, the EU Guy and EUC extreme yt videos make me believe safety and driving wise there won't be a problem and as you said, that's what counts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 23 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: @KingSong69 Thank you once again! I assume the 84V msuper V3 is the right one? What would be the difference to the IPS one above it, it also has two 4 pole connectors. Can this thing damage the wheel? What would happen if you connected the "wrong" one (if there's a wrong one)? there is no wrong way :-) no way to damage ....just gives additional information, can be set to charge to a specifiv voltage (ex. 85%), can use 2 chargers, so double up speed :-) great thing...i have one, too difference is the +- poling...yes the 84volt msuper is right... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted January 28, 2017 Author Share Posted January 28, 2017 1 minute ago, KingSong69 said: there is no wrong way :-) no way to damage ....just gives additional information, can be set to charge to a specifiv voltage (ex. 85%), can use 2 chargers, so double up speed :-) great thing...i have one, too difference is the +- poling...yes the 84volt msuper is right... Thanks+1 Will order one now, the charging graphs are an awesome thing and I like how you can check the overall Wh of the batteries - Vertrauen ist gut, Kontrolle ist besser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 18 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: @Marty Backe You should start your own used wheels shop at this point, then you can try all new models... the nice and shiny new models, all of them... so nice and shiny and exciting... like the ACM 1600 Wh... have you ordered yours yet? My ACM looks fine so I could not follow you. Sad to hear you have issues with how your GWs are built. I hope it's only superficial, the EU Guy and EUC extreme yt videos make me believe safety and driving wise there won't be a problem and as you said, that's what counts. NOW...the Acm and V3 look good...the bit older versions have glossy crappy shell..still the frontlight is a joke, the trolley of v3 to short and unstable like hell, the trolley of Acm screwed into shell? how long the rubberized shell now holds? we will see...inside the GW are a silicon hell around the board, we had reports here of ex. wrong pedals installed and: Attention: power wires to motor not really soldered....so sometimes even safety concerning things ....its a thing of luck which employee installed or soldered your wheel (lately getting better). the app? pffffh.....better dont talk :-) the comunication of improvements? from GW? pure luck...99% i know is from other freax like me...or Marty :-) BUT: performance is great :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 I do want to add that I really like my Gotway wheels. I'm probably coming across as very negative, but in the big picture, the wheels are great. In the five that I've owned and ridden hundreds of miles I've never had a failure. Have I mentioned yet that I got a Gotway tattoo on my butt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 1 minute ago, Marty Backe said: I do want to add that I really like my Gotway wheels. I'm probably coming across as very negative, but in the big picture, the wheels are great. In the five that I've owned and ridden hundreds of miles I've never had a failure. Have I mentioned yet that I got a Gotway tattoo on my butt plus one! without the tattoo.... ....mine is somewhere else! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve454 Posted January 28, 2017 Share Posted January 28, 2017 5 hours ago, meepmeepmayer said: I didn't mean 0% empty (I know that's bad), just maybe 50% so I see if a new charge makes a difference in the max % I get. That's a good idea, but how are you going to do it? From reading about the Gotway with the long range, you would have to ride about 15-20 miles to get down to 50%. I guess after several short rides it will add up, but it would take hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Backe Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 1 hour ago, steve454 said: That's a good idea, but how are you going to do it? From reading about the Gotway with the long range, you would have to ride about 15-20 miles to get down to 50%. I guess after several short rides it will add up, but it would take hours. Yeah, I just got back from a long ride.45 miles at ~4 hours and I have 20% battery remaining. He could turn the light on and charge all of his USB devices (the ACM has the USB charging port) - that might help drain the battery Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meepmeepmayer Posted January 29, 2017 Author Share Posted January 29, 2017 Yes I realized 50% is way easier said than done. I just rode through the house a bit (balcony railings feel really low when you stand on a EUC) and then charged this morning. Aaaand now I'm happy to say that the wheels is now at 88% (wheellog) and a stable 90% (latest GW app) so it looks like the problem is going to vanish soon! Looking forward to seeing what the charge doctor has to say about charger voltage and the Wh of the wheel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mono Posted January 29, 2017 Share Posted January 29, 2017 54 minutes ago, meepmeepmayer said: Looking forward to seeing what the charge doctor has to say about charger voltage and the Wh of the wheel. It will immediately tell you the charger voltage with and without charging. The voltage while charging depends on the battery status, I estimated the battery voltage to be displayed voltage minus 0.7 times displayed current. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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