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I love my V8, really do, but...


Mono

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its directional instability drives me nuts. Driving this wheel straight along longitudinal grooves is more challenging than making small backward circles (which is, admittedly, with this wheel surprisingly easy). I didn't have any crash, but the wobbles are crazy scary and make precise steering super difficult. What is your experience? I suspect the main or even sole reason might be the Kenda tire?

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13 minutes ago, Mono said:

Driving this wheel straight along longitudinal grooves

What do you mean, do you have an example?  Are the grooves deep and wide, or shallow and wide?  Just guessing, but it is probably that particular tire is not suited to those particular grooves, it couldn't be the firmware could it?

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12 hours ago, Mono said:

its directional instability drives me nuts. Driving this wheel straight along longitudinal grooves is more challenging than making small backward circles (which is, admittedly, with this wheel surprisingly easy). I didn't have any crash, but the wobbles are crazy scary and make precise steering super difficult. What is your experience? I suspect the main or even sole reason might be the Kenda tire?

You might try changing to a Chao Yang ... https://tec-toyz.com/products/spare-tire has them and I'm sure @Jason McNeil has them as well.  You can get them through TaoBao agents, e.g. http://www.offerany.com/p-524420885551.html for under $10 not including shipping (which is another $50).  My manual says 16"x 2.125" ... I'm not sure if this is standard, or you have to worry about the width ... would a 2.5" width fit the 2.125 rim?

Edited by Chris Westland
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11 hours ago, steve454 said:

What do you mean, do you have an example?  Are the grooves deep and wide, or shallow and wide?  Just guessing, but it is probably that particular tire is not suited to those particular grooves, it couldn't be the firmware could it?

Pretty much any gap exceeding 1mm will do. Driving straight generally doesn't feel super stable straight. Driving tight curves on the other hand feels like driving on rails.  

Edited by Mono
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I am really surprised. I had a Ninebot One E+ and noticed this kind of problem when I changed the Kenda for a Maxxis Hookworm. But it never reached such a stage (it was for thick road signalization, large cracks on pavements or grids, but not  1mm grooves).

Concerning the Inmotion V8, I have ridden it for 180km and was really amazed by its steadiness, especially when riding straight. Two possibilities :

  • you still need to improve your symbiosis with your new wheel ; it will come naturally
  • you have a problem of tire pressure ; once, my wheel was wobbling and I realised the tire was only at 2.4 bars. According to me, 3.2 bars is a minimum. I ride at 3.7.

So, don't hurry for a tire change. It will not have a magical effect, IMHO.

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6 minutes ago, xebeche said:

@Mono different tire would probably help a lot, but @houseofjob tried to mount Chao Yang H-5167 on V8 and it rubbed against the inner casing, as you can see in this post: 

 

The interest of the Maxxis Hookworm is that it is a 1.95 thick tire. So it leaves a lot of space between the tire and the casing. This tire has a fantastic grip, tolerates high pressure without changing its dimension (inflated above 3.8, a Kenda rubs against inner casing) and its round shape really eases maneuverability. The drawback is that the wheel becomes unstable in longitudinal road malformation or grids.

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7 minutes ago, Gil said:

It's a highly protected secret but I can reveal, for your eyes only, that it is between 96 and 98 kgs ;-)

Thanks for your special revelation. I'm sure it definitely can't be seen by others just as you wish. :lol:

Me myself weight 65 kg for now, and 2.8 to 3.3 bars are to be the best range for me.

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This is quite logical. I determined the right pressure by filming closely the tire while being on it (stationary). I could check the level of tire compression and contact surface with the ground.

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29 minutes ago, Gil said:

inflated above 3.8, a Kenda rubs against inner casing

at least this problem I don't seem to have :). But the margin is tight, literally 1mm distance to the casing. Only on loose ground I can hear constant scratching which I attribute to the earth attached to the tire touching the shell.

Edited by Mono
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31 minutes ago, Gil said:

The interest of the Maxxis Hookworm is that it is a 1.95 thick tire. So it leaves a lot of space between the tire and the casing. This tire has a fantastic grip, tolerates high pressure without changing its dimension (inflated above 3.8, a Kenda rubs against inner casing) and its round shape really eases maneuverability. The drawback is that the wheel becomes unstable in longitudinal road malformation or grids.

and

@Mono different tire would probably help a lot, but @houseofjob tried to mount Chao Yang H-5167 on V8 and it rubbed against the inner casing, as you can see in this post: 

This is interesting, as I was curious what latitude I had in tire widths.  It sounds like 2.125 might be between "max" and "time to lose the spare tire" width.  My V8 is new, so I'm not planning on changing a tire in the near future (and I even Slimed my innertube to stave off the day)

BTW, interesting tread design on the appropriately named Maxxis Hookworm :unsure:

600x600-95692-pb102827.jpg

Edited by Chris Westland
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3 hours ago, xebeche said:

@Mono different tire would probably help a lot, but @houseofjob tried to mount Chao Yang H-5167 on V8 and it rubbed against the inner casing, as you can see in this post: 

 

Yes, will be in my V5F+ vs V8 writeup, but I was unsuccessful in swapping for the Chao Yang tire (tire itself fits initially), as the tire enclosure space is way too narrow and rubs too hard with each revolution. Even the stock Kenda tire has some rub, but not to this degree. (all tires inflated to 5 PSI under max).

@Chris Westland I also did try fitting the Maxxis Hookworm on as well. I haven't ridden on it, but the rub when spinning the wheel seemed along the lines of the stock Kenda tire.

 

I know what @Mono is talking about. For me, I believe the issue is twofold: 1 part component weight distribution, and 1 part swiveling motion of all InMotion EUCs.

From the start, the V8 felt top-heavy to me, which kind of makes sense if you think about it, what with the battery+board situated on top, combined with the lighter weight Kenda stock tire. My hope in a successful Chao Yang tire swap was that the heavier weight of the Chao Yang (this brand is heavier than all other brands stated here) would balance this weight distribution out.

I would say the issue is not severe, but noticeable enough to be annoying (like always, one will adjust / compensate). Those without prior experience, or little experience on other wheels will probably not notice at all.

 

The other part is that all InMotion wheels want to turn (and turn they do the best!), so trying to non-chalantly go straight might result in some wobble. I usually recommend riding on a constant 'turn', even when going straight (ie. favoring one side).

Edited by houseofjob
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I think the V8 having a slight wobble at high speeds is related to the tread pattern on the tire.  Here is a comparison of the Kenda on my Ninebot to the Kenda on the V8.  Notice that the V8 (lower pic) has a stupid wavy pattern to the center rubber....  :facepalm:

 

 

fullsizeoutput_3a4a.jpeg

fullsizeoutput_3a4c.jpeg

Edited by rdalcanto
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I want to add that with experience, the wobbles on the V8 become less of an issue.  It is disappointing that the Chao Yang doesn't fit the V8, as I was waiting for Jason to receive his shipment so that I could order one from him.  :cry2:

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Well @rdalcanto that's interesting about the tire treads.  I compared your two treads to my 14" Kenda, expecting it to match that of the Ninebot, BUT NOooo! It's an exact match for your V8 tire with "that stupid wavy pattern ", albeit in 14" obvs.

so what's my point? I'm glad you asked.  I have reported here and I have video, that my ride is SUPER stable over any sort of crack.  Any crack any size, any length.  I Can and frequently do run right down cracks, gaps, whatever, for hundreds of yards, by choice, and only occasionally I get a wiggle to let me know that a direction, not of my choosing,has been selected.  But it's never an issue, mostly a " thanks for the message, I'll take it under advisement" AND.. it runs in a straight line, just fine.

so what's going on here then.  I love my Kenda on the smooth, I love it on the rough. I never have to wonder if my tire is conspiring against me, and with my wheel, Lassie, that's a coalition of one.

possibly the same tread in a different size is the issue.  I've read reports of this about car and motorcycle tyres.

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That is interesting Smoother.  :huh:

There goes my theory....

Although I wouldn't be surprised if pressure and rider weight makes a difference in the tire patch on the ground and the behavior of the tire.

Edited by rdalcanto
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12 hours ago, houseofjob said:

Yes, will be in my V5F+ vs V8 writeup, but I was unsuccessful in swapping for the Chao Yang tire (tire itself fits initially), as the tire enclosure space is way too narrow and rubs too hard with each revolution. Even the stock Kenda tire has some rub, but not to this degree. (all tires inflated to 5 PSI under max).

@Chris Westland I also did try fitting the Maxxis Hookworm on as well. I haven't ridden on it, but the rub when spinning the wheel seemed along the lines of the stock Kenda tire.

 

I know what @Mono is talking about. For me, I believe the issue is twofold: 1 part component weight distribution, and 1 part swiveling motion of all InMotion EUCs.

From the start, the V8 felt top-heavy to me, which kind of makes sense if you think about it, what with the battery+board situated on top, combined with the lighter weight Kenda stock tire. My hope in a successful Chao Yang tire swap was that the heavier weight of the Chao Yang (this brand is heavier than all other brands stated here) would balance this weight distribution out.

I would say the issue is not severe, but noticeable enough to be annoying (like always, one will adjust / compensate). Those without prior experience, or little experience on other wheels will probably not notice at all.

 

The other part is that all InMotion wheels want to turn (and turn they do the best!), so trying to non-chalantly go straight might result in some wobble. I usually recommend riding on a constant 'turn', even when going straight (ie. favoring one side).

I've noticed that when riding my V8, it's usually 'pressing' more against my left calf. 

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12 hours ago, rdalcanto said:

 

Although I wouldn't be surprised if pressure and rider weight makes a difference in the tire patch on the ground

That could be a factor, of course the size and shape of the contact patch will change, as you say.  I have ridden my 14" around 47psi but mostly at the max of 65 psi, because I don't want to pinch and "pressure cut the sidewall". Other than the very hard feeling, and zero give when hitting rocks, curbs, and the more sprightly turning,  at 65psi, I don't recall any difference in the "crack tracing issue". I haven't put air in mine since about 300 km ago, so it's probably leaking down a bit.  I'll keep a "foot" out for if it behaves differently around cracks as the pressure leaks down.

have you V8 riders experimented with different tyre pressures?

Edited by Smoother
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Because of its slim shell form, the V8 is a wheel where my leg position allows some tilting of the wheel between my legs. When driving straight, I still have to find a way to prevent this titling entirely while remaining in a comfortable relaxed position. I believe the titling contributes to the instability and it might even be the major reason for it. Indeed, when riding curves, the touch becomes tight and doesn't allow this back and forth tilting anymore. I would need to find a curved groove to ride over for testing this.

Edited by Mono
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I have tried various combinations of grip, no grip, pads, no pads.  I find there are "horses for courses" as my father used to say.  When I turn I use one of several options: I either lean the wheel in like normal, or if I want absolute control, I grip with my calves, but if it's an off camber curve (I.e. I'm turning up hill) and I don't want to dig my pedal in and ground loop off the damn thing, I lean the wheel the other way, hard against my outer calf, to keep the wheel as upright as possible.  Also when going over rough terrain, I grip hard with my calves so that if the wheel hesitates over an obstacle, as my body weight moves ahead of the wheel, my calves pull it forward, thus powering up for the obstacle.  If I just left it to my feet, I'd be running, before the wheel caught up with me.  Saying all that, im surprised you have so much side to side.  I thought the V8 made good contact with the upper calf, via the handle and corresponding bump on the other side.

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The bulbs allow to have quite good controlled contact with the wheel during all kind of manoeuvres. Unlike with a boxed shell however they don't ask for a tight touch while just going straight.

Edited by Mono
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I've been away from the forum for a bit too long so here are my 2cents (notes: Distance wheeled 200km, V8 is my first EUC):

- Tire pressure: My stock kenda tyre isn't round so I already get a rub at 3 bar, which is really not that awesome really. I like the handling better on the hard tyre so I'm always keeping it close to the case ;). I do have a spare chao yang tyre but I just don't have the heart to swap it out for testing (heard it wasn't that easy :P).

- Wobbling, as posted in my initial review this was a serious issue for me in the beginning, it's nearly completely gone by now. I must admit that I don't have experience driving over longitudinal grooves so maybe it doesn't compare. @Mono do you know someone with a v8 close to you? Maybe you can drive his unit to see if it's a unit specific problem or not.

Overall I can drive nonchalantly straight without getting a wobble (or maybe i'm just so much of an airhead that I don't even notice the wobbling anymore).

 

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