Marty Backe

ACM 16 Dumps Me When Starting On An Incline

68 posts in this topic

8 minutes ago, Marty Backe said:

@noisycarlos had the Ninebot, so he only did the Hollywood Hills segment. @jrkline had the KS18 and he made the whole trip (plus a couple of miles) with only a few breaks needed due to overheating. But remember, these were extreme conditions: steep hills and 95 degree temperatures.

I posted a summary in the Local Groups forum, and I think @noisycarlos will be posting some video.

Glad to hear all of that. We have very few hills here except for going up and down the numerous bridges that span the intracoastal waterway here on the west coast of Florida but of course we do see similar temperatures. How I wish I lived near you and could have taken that ride as one of your minions :D. thanks, again

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1 hour ago, Greg Spalding said:

Glad to hear all of that. We have very few hills here except for going up and down the numerous bridges that span the intracoastal waterway here on the west coast of Florida but of course we do see similar temperatures. How I wish I lived near you and could have taken that ride as one of your minions :D. thanks, again

Well, from some videos I've seen, Florida has a lot of nice bike (and therefore EUC) friendly roads and paths to ride. I don't envy your humidity though ;-)

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we are lucky to be able to ride 12 months a year (as you are)... the humidity is another story. i've been here since 1972 and i've never come close to getting used to it :blink:

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I just got an ACM and was worried about this cut off at startup. I tried to reproduce it but I haven't been able to so far. I'm loving the extra power but missing the comfort and polish of my ninebot as the ACM is much wider and rattles going over bumps. I'll sacrifice it though for the extra power and speed. 

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3 minutes ago, Shoe73 said:

I just got an ACM and was worried about this cut off at startup. I tried to reproduce it but I haven't been able to so far. I'm loving the extra power but missing the comfort and polish of my ninebot as the ACM is much wider and rattles going over bumps. I'll sacrifice it though for the extra power and speed. 

I have about 400 miles on my ACM. It's only happened 3 times, and only when jumping on while pointing uphill, I think a bit aggressively. So now if I'm not on a level surface I mount and then slowly push forward.

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I did try starting uphill but I may not have been aggressive enough to trigger the problem. So far, satisfied. 

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7 hours ago, Shoe73 said:

I just got an ACM and was worried about this cut off at startup. I tried to reproduce it but I haven't been able to so far. I'm loving the extra power but missing the comfort and polish of my ninebot as the ACM is much wider and rattles going over bumps. I'll sacrifice it though for the extra power and speed. 

The "start-up folding" is happen relativly seldom...but it happens! I have about 300km on my Msuper V3 and had it 3 times...

And Attention: Has nothing to do with Time, so it not only happens in the first 5 seconds or so!

It is also possible you have your wheel powered on for 30 seconds and pushed it by the trolley...and when you jump on then it folds and collapsed! It is (like it was on KS) a "first real lean in" fault...

 

What i do to prevent this from Happening is after powering on, i always push it back and forth by Hand on a Little aggressive way! When doing that (until now) i dont have a a folding/collapse....

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On 9/23/2016 at 3:52 PM, Greg Spalding said:

i just wish they wouldn't LET their wheels travel at 60 kmh

same here, but to be fair to Gotway also, I believe the most common concern from experienced potential buyers over the last year-or-so has been lack of speed. Of course if the standard becomes 25km/h, this concern will also become less frequent, though I just read another post today claiming that 25km//h is an unacceptably low (and apparently unsafe) speed limit.

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On 9/23/2016 at 8:41 AM, HEC said:

That's exactly my point but I would not ride ANY wheel at 40 Km/h - 30 is more than enough as top speed with "safe" cruise speed around 25 - 26 Km/h max. It's nice that GW is trying to make so many "firsts" in area of EUCs but I personally feel that they're not big and most of all advanced enough to be a (safe) leader in such market. They'll indeed despite all the shortcomings still find their semi-niche market between experienced EUC enthusiasts but I'd really hesitate to recommend their wheels to normal consumers or newcomers to EUC hobby / commute.

i appreciate your thoughts and agree

GotWay is too small and not in this business to be the first in safety

NINEBOT/SEGWAY is the ONLY company at this moment who has the CLOUT and CAPITAL to put safety first....

when folks argue that they think EUCs are on the way UP and not DOWN, all i have to do is point toward NINEBOT/SEGWAY...

if THEY thought that, they'd really be making more models and be a bigger player in the industry right now

i just don't think they are interested in this market segment any longer

the S2 really isn't nothing with innovation

Inmotion MIGHT be the company to make a difference in world-wide perception... time will tell

from what i've seen on the internet their wheels really aren't selling in enough numbers to show anyone cares

coming out with the V8 with such a small battery... telling us it was easily exchangeable, just to fine out it is NOT means to me that they want to be some niche company and make a wheel that...

1.  has pretty lights

2.  is light enough to be a perform tricks well 

3.  isn't meant for serious commuting

 

maybe the $400.00 "starter" wheels will survive but GotWay and King Song will have to UP THEIR SAFETY game (knowing that EUCs can never TRULY be "SAFE' if the $1,500.00 wheels will ever be popular

 

IMHO, of course

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On 10/16/2016 at 3:15 PM, Greg Spalding said:

coming out with the V8 with such a small battery... telling us it was easily exchangeable, just to fine out it is NOT means to me that they want to be some niche company and make a wheel that...

1.  has pretty lights

2.  is light enough to be a perform tricks well 

3.  isn't meant for serious commuting

 

the realistic range for "such a small" 480Wh battery is around 30km, which is probably more than enough for most potential EUC commuters. I would think that only a quite small fraction of potential EUC users (<10%) would be willing to make more daily commuting distance. I am pretty sure (and we can easily fact check) that also only a small fraction of bicycle commuters make a larger daily distance. I can imagine the fraction is much larger in this forum though.

Edited by MoNo
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I'd imagine starting on an incline with an aggressive rider tilt requesting high acceleration likely demands a high surge of current to start the wheel going from a stand still.  Has anyone logged the current spike reading in these start up situations?  I wonder if that spike might trigger the BMS to shut things down to protect the battery?  A good experiement might be to do a series of starts on the incline at various leans to see the current graphs.

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right, though the problem might not be so much the battery than the heat generated from the current. Demanding torque without moving/accelerating (e.g. against a wall) seems a reliable method to fry an unprotected board.

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Dang it, how did miss this thread.  Not too flattering for the Gotway ACM.  Dang it!

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43 minutes ago, Wagtenor said:

Dang it, how did miss this thread.  Not too flattering for the Gotway ACM.  Dang it!

This only happened to me a few times in the early days and I'm convinced that it has to do with starting aggressively when on an incline. Speed was 0 mph so it was only embarrassing, not painful. That's twice over 800 miles of riding. I don't think it's a problem worth worrying about.

I just bought another ACM, so you know how confident I am with the wheel.

Edited by Marty Backe
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On 9/23/2016 at 7:58 AM, Greg Spalding said:

isn't that something?

i had NO idea Gotway didn't allow firmware updates via their app.

why on earth would THAT be?

 

On 9/23/2016 at 8:11 AM, HEC said:

It's not about not "allowing it" - it's more about lack of resources to develop the updateable FW or even at least half decent mobile apps ... Most of the current EUC manufacturers including GW are ran more like Mom's & Pop's  shops than real company with all departments fully staffed with qualified personnel. You can see the "assembly lines" are just a few shelf in some crappy old warehouse, minimum or none QA, only basic own development, using cheap sub-par parts originally intended for another purpose and so on :( If GW can't get something simple like the cover screws right I'd not expect them (nor want) to venture into for them unexplored waters of FW updates ;) 

I revisited this 10 month old topic. @HEC was absolutely correct that GW is the only EUC company that does not allow the customer to update firmware via their phone app.  Nothing has changed!

Where the heck is HEC?

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Made me Kind of laughing, sorry...

You can't be affraid about GW or telling they don't have a QM. (Maybe they don't have. But that's not the point!) Just read the manual! In my Version I can read things like: no offroad, carfully, gently acc, the right sequence to put the charger on and off...

If you use your wheel like this - nothing happens to you or your wheel. (Excludes the bad fw issues last time) And I'm sure, if you live in the U.S. or know something about America, you know also these funny stickers like: all objects in the mirror..., the "hot coffee lawsuit, cats in microwaves, ...

And now, for real, you're sure a chinese mom & pop's shop will, or have to, provide you quality like BMW, S&W or Sony?

The real problem is, if you want to have fun - you are "out of the manual". Therefore you can test something with your wheel. Offroad, more than 115 Kgs, riding throug deep water. But don't blame GW for this.

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On 10/16/2016 at 3:39 PM, Hunka Hunka Burning Love said:

I'd imagine starting on an incline with an aggressive rider tilt requesting high acceleration likely demands a high surge of current to start the wheel going from a stand still.

I almost never start uphill, unless the incline is very slight. Most of the time I go sideways for a couple of feet to get started, then attack the hill.

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Posted (edited)

On 7/11/2017 at 8:41 AM, man-on(e)-wheel said:

Made me Kind of laughing, sorry...

You can't be affraid about GW or telling they don't have a QM. (Maybe they don't have. But that's not the point!) Just read the manual! In my Version I can read things like: no offroad, carfully, gently acc, the right sequence to put the charger on and off...

If you use your wheel like this - nothing happens to you or your wheel. (Excludes the bad fw issues last time) And I'm sure, if you live in the U.S. or know something about America, you know also these funny stickers like: all objects in the mirror..., the "hot coffee lawsuit, cats in microwaves, ...

And now, for real, you're sure a chinese mom & pop's shop will, or have to, provide you quality like BMW, S&W or Sony?

The real problem is, if you want to have fun - you are "out of the manual". Therefore you can test something with your wheel. Offroad, more than 115 Kgs, riding throug deep water. But don't blame GW for this.

That's a great summary of the current EUC market.

In my opinion, the "out of the manual" area is where most of the growth is happening in the EUC market. Other than beginners, the market is already saturated with Ninebot S2 type wheels.With the current "enthusiast grade" wheels and definitely the next generation of wheels, the "mom & pop shops" absolutely must reach maturity in their development techniques and QA techniques. It's not impossible just because the companies are small. They need to learn from the problems and get serious about improving. I'm not saying they can equal BMW, but I believe they can do MUCH BETTER than they are now, even though a small company and limited resources.

Edited by MaxLinux
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