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dbfrese

Getting Legislators to Act

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who_the    289

Great work! Good luck. California does not describe "Electric personal assistive mobility devices" in that fashion. Instead, a new term of "Electrically motorized board" was created, which distinguishes our devices as different from "motorized skateboards" and essentially allows them to be equivalent to bicycles on public roads, paths and bikeways. I'd prefer a bit broader adoption, where use on sidewalks is permitted (with speed limitations), but I've never had a problem with law enforcement challenging my ability to ride, and always cite VC 21113 to anyone who asks. Few do. Enjoy your ride!

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dbfrese    411

Update: the bill has been introduced to the Arizona Senate, and assigned to appropriate committees. :thumbup:

Woo hoo! Link to text of bill below:

https://legiscan.com/AZ/text/SB1017/2017 

Fellow Arizona EUCers, please respond below if you are willing to help out (by sending emails, official comments, etc.). I will coordinate any necessary action. 

Thanks!

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Ombre    269

Good work!  Happy to help as I can.

It will be nice to have clear law defining the legality of EUCs in Arizona.  This will mean EUCs will have all the legal rights of pedestrians ... as long as the wheel is limited to 15 MPH.  There are a lot of multi-use paths around town that currently are off-limits to "motorized vehicles".

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dbfrese    411
30 minutes ago, Ombre said:

Happy to help as I can.

Excellent! I will let you know if there is anything you can do. This may actually not be that big of a deal. The senator I'm working with says that the legislature is in a "de-regulatory mood" lately, and since the Department of Transportation has no objections, it could be pretty easy, but you never know.. 

Can you PM me your email address or phone number for texting? That way I can get in touch with you faster than through the forum. 

You are certainly welcome to come to the first committee meaning if you want. It's first hearing will be with the Senate Transportation Committee (Senate Meeting Room 1) on Tuesday Jan 17 at 2PM. It's a long drive from Tucson to go to a mostly boring committee meeting, but if you have the time, come on up!

Thanks for the support!

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Marty Backe    6,399

Great work. My only concern is the 15 mph limit. Just about all EUCs that are being produced are capable of speeds greater than that (and I'm not talking about Gotway's). I'm sure it won't make a practical difference, but if someone wanted to make a power move they could say current EUCs are illegal.

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dbfrese    411
2 hours ago, Marty Backe said:

Great work. My only concern is the 15 mph limit.

Agreed, and I do believe you are right that it won't make a practical difference. Are cops really going to investigate the specs on all the various EUC models?

On the other hand, I think it's better to get EUCs recognized in the law first, then possibly address the speed issue in a future session. An attempt to ask for a 20 MPH limit, for example, (not even close to a Gotway Monster's 31 MPH) and you could very easily jeopardize passage of the bill. Legislators could object to potentially endangering school children on public sidewalks as they make their way to school, or something like that, and I'm not sure if I would have a convincing argument to assuage their doubts.

Edited by dbfrese
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Marty Backe    6,399
1 hour ago, dbfrese said:

Agreed, and I do believe you are right that it won't make a practical difference. Are cops really going to investigate the specs on all the various EUC models?

On the other hand, I think it's better to get EUCs recognized in the law first, then possibly address the speed issue in a future session. An attempt to ask for a 20 MPH limit, for example, (not even close to a Gotway Monster's 31 MPH) and you could very easily jeopardize passage of the bill. Legislators could object to potentially endangering school children on public sidewalks as they make their way to school, or something like that, and I'm not sure if I would have a convincing argument to assuage their doubts.

Agreed. Somehow California allows EUC's, electric skateboards, bicycles, etc. to travel at 20 mph. Whew!

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Marty Backe    6,399
32 minutes ago, Michael Vu said:

<snip>

Basically I want EUCs to be viewed by Texas law as the same as a bicycle.

Take a look at the California law. It allows EUCs wherever bicycles are allowed unless expressly forbidden (e.g. Segways or any electric vehicles are not allowed here).

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dbfrese    411

@Michael Vu, please feel free to pm me and exchange emails. Since AZ is a step ahead of TX on this, I'd be glad to answer any questions you might have on the process. 

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Ombre    269
13 hours ago, Michael Vu said:

What I am aiming in Texas is not only permitting EUC use on sidewalks and trails, but also on the regular streets. Basically I want EUCs to be viewed by Texas law as the same as a bicycle.

Sounds good, just be careful about wording there.  In AZ we have "multi-use trails" where "anything without a motor" is allowed.  That could, depending on wording, exclude EUCs.

But by defining EUCs in AZ as "Electric personal assistive mobility devices" we leveraged the prior work done for Segways and essentially made them equivalent to pedestrians, which means we have access to all trails, sidewalks, ramps, etc., including the multi-use trails.

The compromise of that is that EUCs aren't "vehicles" in AZ and therefore have limited access to roadways.  You might be forced to choose which you value more in Texas: roads or trails.  Personally I prefer having legal access to the multi-use trails over access to roads, but that's due to the nature of the roads here.  Very few streets here are preferable to sidewalks and trails for EUC use.

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Michael Vu    408
3 hours ago, Ombre said:

Sounds good, just be careful about wording there.  In AZ we have "multi-use trails" where "anything without a motor" is allowed.  That could, depending on wording, exclude EUCs.

But by defining EUCs in AZ as "Electric personal assistive mobility devices" we leveraged the prior work done for Segways and essentially made them equivalent to pedestrians, which means we have access to all trails, sidewalks, ramps, etc., including the multi-use trails.

The compromise of that is that EUCs aren't "vehicles" in AZ and therefore have limited access to roadways.  You might be forced to choose which you value more in Texas: roads or trails.  Personally I prefer having legal access to the multi-use trails over access to roads, but that's due to the nature of the roads here.  Very few streets here are preferable to sidewalks and trails for EUC use.

Yep I understand all of this from being stopped on trails and on the road. But I'm really trying to be ambitious by having my cake and eating it too by trying to get EUCs allowed on both trails and the road for the simple fact that bicycles are allowed to do that now. We also have the "No Motor Vehicles" on trails, but EUCs won't fall under "motor vehicle" once the definition of an EPAMD is changed. Basically exactly what was accomplished in Arizona.

The biggest thing is permitting EUC use on roadways which is why I simply want to say to lawmakers and police to view EUCs as a bicycle. I have modified the existing Texas code to try to explicitly state this:

SUBCHAPTER C. ELECTRIC PERSONAL ASSISTIVE MOBILITY DEVICES
Sec. 551.201.  DEFINITION.  In this subchapter, "electric personal assistive mobility device" means a two non-tandem wheeled device designed for transporting one person that is:

(1)  self-balancing;  and
(2)  propelled by an electric propulsion system with an average power of 750 watts or one horsepower.
(3)  less than 100 pounds
(4)  less than 3 feet wide

Added by Acts 2003, 78th Leg., ch. 1318, Sec. 5, eff. Sept. 1, 2003.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sec. 551.202.  OPERATION ON ROADWAY.  (a)  A person may operate an electric personal assistive mobility device on a residential street, roadway, or public highway with a speed limit of

30 miles per hour or less only:

   (1)  while making a direct crossing of a highway in a marked or unmarked crosswalk;

    (2)  where no sidewalk is available;  or

    (3)  when so directed by a traffic control device or by a law enforcement officer.

(b)  A person may operate an electric personal assistive mobility device on a path set aside for the exclusive operation of bicycles.

(c)  Any person operating an electric personal assistive mobility device on a residential street, roadway, or public highway shall ride as close as practicable to the right-hand edge.

(d)  Except as otherwise provided by this section, provisions of this title applicable to the operation of bicycles apply to the operation of electric personal assistive mobility devices.

Added by Acts 2003, 78th Leg., ch. 1318, Sec. 5, eff. Sept. 1, 2003.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sec. 551.203.  SIDEWALKS.  A person may operate an electric personal assistive mobility device on a sidewalk.

 

 

I ride with bicycle groups all of the time to really show off to everybody that EUCs should be looked at as no different from a bicycle. Because its one thing to be stopped by police saying you cannot ride here when you are by yourself, but its a totally different dynamic if you're riding with other bicyclist and doing everything that they are doing.

 

Edited by Michael Vu

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dbfrese    411
2 hours ago, Ombre said:

Sounds good, just be careful about wording there.  In AZ we have "multi-use trails" where "anything without a motor" is allowed.  That could, depending on wording, exclude EUCs.

But by defining EUCs in AZ as "Electric personal assistive mobility devices" we leveraged the prior work done for Segways and essentially made them equivalent to pedestrians, which means we have access to all trails, sidewalks, ramps, etc., including the multi-use trails.

The compromise of that is that EUCs aren't "vehicles" in AZ and therefore have limited access to roadways.  You might be forced to choose which you value more in Texas: roads or trails.  Personally I prefer having legal access to the multi-use trails over access to roads, but that's due to the nature of the roads here.  Very few streets here are preferable to sidewalks and trails for EUC use.

Well stated. It seems like there are always compromises between the ideal and the possible when making or amending laws. For Texas the situation is likely different and will require a different solution. That's what so great about different states and different laws -- we can see what works, what works better and what doesn't work at all once implemented!

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dbfrese    411

BTW -- yesterday at the legislature I was also able to meet one of the prime sponsors of the original Segway (EPAMD) bill that passed in 2002 in Arizona. In fact, he attended the hearing and watched my testimony and demonstration of of my Ninebot around the hearing room, just because he was intersted in seeing the new device.

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Michael Vu    408
On 1/18/2017 at 5:49 PM, dbfrese said:

BTW -- yesterday at the legislature I was also able to meet one of the prime sponsors of the original Segway (EPAMD) bill that passed in 2002 in Arizona. In fact, he attended the hearing and watched my testimony and demonstration of of my Ninebot around the hearing room, just because he was intersted in seeing the new device.

Awesome! Just saw the video of you testifying. Too bad the camera didn't catch you actually riding around.

I talked to my senator last week and gave him a demo. He was all on board too. So the next step for me is to work with his people to draft up the changes and then go up to the capital sometime to testify.

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dbfrese    411
11 hours ago, Michael Vu said:

Just saw the video of you testifying.

It really is kind of awkward with the protocol in testifying to a committee and answering questions, with the formal, "Mr. Chairman, members of the committee" stuff. I know I stumbled through a few things, including getting the bill number wrong! But they are all really nice people, and pretty forgiving.

I do have another piece of news. There were no objections to Arizona SB1017 being placed on the "Consent Calendar" which means that the bill gets to skip the "Committee of the Whole" (COW), where if there were objections, it would be debated by members on the floor. Instead, it will be given its "third read" and final vote in the Arizona Senate this afternoon (January 26, 2017) at 1:30PM (or thereabouts). :clap3:

I will be watching the vote on the legislature's live stream. (http://azleg.granicus.com/MediaPlayer.php?publish_id=3

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Ombre    269

Excellent work. Thanks for representing all of us. 

BTW, a video of you riding an EUC in a hearing room of the state capitol would have been the coolest thing I've ever seen on this forum.  They never catch the best stuff on camera...

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Clovis    55
1 hour ago, Ombre said:

Excellent work. Thanks for representing all of us. 

BTW, a video of you riding an EUC in a hearing room of the state capitol would have been the coolest thing I've ever seen on this forum.  They never catch the best stuff on camera...

Actually, there is a video of him demonstrating his Ninebot One to the members of the committee.  Great job in presenting the pro's of riding an EUC.  I also live in AZ and would love to know that my EUC is legal to ride on the sidewalks.  Below is the link to the video and skip to 30:29 for the "good stuff".

http://azleg.granicus.com/MediaPlayer.php?view_id=13&clip_id=18335&meta_id=379732

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