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Gunthor

Kingsong KS16-A Tinnitus and more...

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Jason McNeil    3,147

@Gunthor good feedback. Can you record an audio track of the noise/frequency? Did you find the fan is enabled only while riding after a certain amount of time, or is it on all the time? Flaky App & poor quality manual can be easily remedied. Still, it looks like there a couple areas for improvement.

@Henrik Olsen what are you thoughts on these issues?  

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Jason McNeil    3,147
35 minutes ago, Henrik Olsen said:

Never uses it... Manuals are for girls... 

:lol:

36 minutes ago, Henrik Olsen said:

My fan is fine, but it do run all the time... I only hear it indoor with the wheel turned on... The fan in my opinion is small price to pay if it can help prevent mosfet burnouts seen by other brands. 

They told me it was programmed only to turn on at 50°C, wonder if this will be sorted out in an upcoming firmware release.

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Henrik Olsen    403
14 minutes ago, Jason McNeil said:

:lol:

They told me it was programmed only to turn on at 50°C, wonder if this will be sorted out in an upcoming firmware release.

Yes, I think it can ... 

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Cloud    1,940
45 minutes ago, Jason McNeil said:

:lol:

They told me it was programmed only to turn on at 50°C, wonder if this will be sorted out in an upcoming firmware release.

Wouldnt change a thing for me - i only ride above 50 C :) 

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dmethvin    1,527
4 hours ago, Gunthor said:

My new Kingsong arrived today and I hate the noise!!!

  1. Especially when riding around 15 Km/h there is a high pitched noise that is ringing in the ears. Always when getting close to people I wanted to hide like "I am not the one aggravating and molesting you with this tinnitus like sound emissions on purpose". I am afraid that the sound is created by the engine because the faster I ride the louder the nuisance. 

@Gunthor How old are you? It may be that your hearing is still really good, don't worry that won't last forever. There are some sample tones at http://www.ultrasonic-ringtones.com/ and the best I can do is 14.9KHz now.

 

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DS    421
3 hours ago, dmethvin said:

There are some sample tones at http://www.ultrasonic-ringtones.com/ and the best I can do is 14.9KHz now.

Funny...thanks to my better right ear I hear up to 21.1Khz and the site verdict is:

You are a dog
Or maybe you are a mosquito, you certainly can't be human.

:D:D:D I'm 49y+4m

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Cloud    1,940

I can hear 17.5 but not 18 or higher. I am 42

i actually stop hearing it around 14khz and then start again at 15, but after 15 the way i hear it the pitch is going down with frequency increase., then stop hearing around 17.9. Not sure how to explain the reversed pitch direction

Edited by Cloud

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Cloud    1,940
16 hours ago, DS said:

Funny...thanks to my better right ear I hear up to 21.1Khz and the site verdict is:

You are a dog
Or maybe you are a mosquito, you certainly can't be human.

:D:D:D I'm 49y+4m

You dont look like a dog, but This means that you might be an alien

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Addwyn    60
On 04/08/2016 at 10:50 PM, Gunthor said:

 

3. Firmware update is inconsistent: I updated from version 1.13 to 1.16. After the update the display still shows current firmware version 1.13!!! OK - I switched Kingsong off and on again, restarted the app and then it displayed current firmware version 1.15 new firmware 1.16!!! I didn't monitor the update so I thought something went wrong and I missed an error message. So I repeated the steps and wanted to upgrade from 1.15 to 1.16. However, no error showed up and the current version is still 1.15. I think that there probably was a buggy 1.16 version that got replaced with the previous 1.15 version and I can most likely consider myself lucky to not have gotten the 1.16 version...

5. The fan of the control board sounds like the ball bearings are already broken.

 

It is exactly similar here with my new KS16a wheel :-(

 

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Addwyn    60
On 8/4/2016 at 10:50 PM, Gunthor said:

I invite users who already experienced the Kingsong KS-16A to share their first impressions as well.

  1. The Voice promts On/Off setting and the Front&Rear Lights On/Off setting are not memorized. They come back to defaults each time the wheel is turned On (Running mode setting and speed alarm levels settings are kept in persistent memory).
     
  2. There is a low but continuous very high-pitched and rather unpleasant electronic whistling when the wheel is powered (like having tinnitus). I was hoping that it would not be annoying outdoor, but Gunthor says that's worst !!!
     
  3. The side LEDs can't be turned off.
Edited by Addwyn
English language mistakes
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Addwyn    60
On 8/4/2016 at 10:50 PM, Gunthor said:

9. The app displays a loudspeaker icon on the first screen that appears when starting the app. However I can neither turn off the beeps nor adjust the sound level. The Kingsong only beeps when clicking on it.

I agree. That's simply a horn icon (for honking like a car). The beeps/voice's sound level can't be adjusted. :-(

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Chuts    182

Back when @Kevin Lee was testing the KS16 and filmed it at the Hong Kong Electronics Fair I always thought the noise it made was really loud as if someone was vacuuming in the back ground.  Is it due to the new tech that is used or is it just a brand signature.

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Gunthor    79

I confirm what Addwyn noticed: The side LEDs can't be turned off. 

As for the whistling / vacuuming / tinnitus noise:
I couldn't wait and unleashed the full potential (Many "Thank Yous" to fearedbliss and esaj) today. I dared to drive 28Km/h and I think this high pitch noise does not get loader than when driving 15 Km/h. Sometimes there was a side wind an I couldn't hear the noise then. However when there are buildings on the left and right I perceive this noise as very disturbing. Indoors you can hear it in a totally silent room simply when switching on the wheel. Outdoors I need to start driving in order to perceive it. Are there any EUC riders out there having experience with different 800Watt EUCs (e.g. Gotway,...)? I wonder if this is a 800Watt EUC issue or something only Kingsong has...

16 hours ago, Addwyn said:

The Voice promts On/Off setting and the Front&Rear Lights On/Off setting are not memorized. They come back to defaults each time the wheel is turned On (Running mode setting and speed alarm levels settings are kept in persistent memory).

Can't confirm this one. After the firmware update this setting was gone. But once set it is memorized. Do you use the new app Addwyn?

@dmethvin,
I will be 48 soon and cannot hear the 14.9KHz. I believe the pitch Kingsong emanates is around 10 KHz but this is most likely a poor guess.

@Henrik Olsen,
I noticed my fan is very quiet when the wheel is not moving - as soon as the wheel moves my fan issues those "out of order ball bearing" noises. So "Yes" the fan is always on but seems to be powered differently when moving...

How fast can you ride uphill? I continue to crawl up on a 17% incline probably because I don't dare to lean forward any harder (I love my body and my EUC and don't want to harm them). I did this with my Ninebot once and without giving any kind of warning beeps it simply stalled giving me a faceplant! Will the Kingsong give warning singnals before you reach its limit so that users will know that e.g. 12 Km/h is the fastest you could dare with a certain incline...?

One more thing:
The app displayed this morning that I could continue to ride 27 Km (680Wh fully charged)! After riding 34Km the app displays that I still can ride another 15 Km. So at first I was afraid if I got the correct battery - now I think I have 680Wh even though I don't know how to verify this one without opening the case. The manual (last page) says "the battery can't be dismantled[...], in case of changing  please contact us". Changing the battery on a Ninebot One is a piece of cake. Did someone open up the Kingsong KS-16A who may be able tell us if this manual instruction is a hoax? I cannot believe that you need extra special Kingsong tools in order replace the battery...

Auxiliary button:
I like the auxiliary button only because of what could be done with it in the future. Like a camera with custom buttons that you can program yourself (what it should do) I think EUC riders need custom buttons too. Functions that come to mind are:

  1. Press it once in order to limit speed to 6 Km/h. Then EUCs in Germany can adhere to local law in order to ride them in pedestrian streets (and pressing a button is a lot more conveniant than fumbling out your moblie,...). Press it another time and revert it back to the normal custom speed settings.
  2. Lock the wheel (like the Ninebot One app locking function) when parking the wheel outside of e.g. a bakery. Unlocking has to be done through the app then. Could be a dangerous one if you don't carry your smartphone with you... :D
  3. Honk - for those riding around without a finger bell and the ability to ride seated or doing squats while riding.
  4. Switching the lights on and off.

Do you remember the three questions I asked (this post got longer than I anticipated...)? BTW I edited my first post as well... take a look at point 11.

Edited by Gunthor
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Gunthor    79

@Дмитрий Дмитрий
Thank you for the pix. It is the first time I see a dismantled KS16. Now I understand why I had difficulties getting used to the wheel. The 9b1 has only one battery pack (on the right side I think). With two battery packs the KS16 is balanced  more evenly. So in fact within the last year I got used to work against the inferior 9b1 balance and now switching to Kingsong I need to learn how to ride properly...

@Jason McNeil
Awesome!!! You are my man!!! I hope I will be able to repeat this with the KS16 on the next weekend but I'd expect to also find similar spikes. I got a dog-bite last year when riding my 9b1 - today I passed about 30 dogs and none of them went 'mental' - perhaps because of the frequencies...? Maybe someone with a non-Kingsong 800W EUC would be so kind to repeat Jasons 'Advanced Spectrum' test? Then we are getting closer to an educated guess if it is a proprietary Kingsong or a general 800W issue...

Edited by Gunthor
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esaj    5,292
52 minutes ago, Gunthor said:

Maybe someone with a non-Kingsong 800W EUC would be so kind to repeat Jasons 'Advanced Spectrum' test? Then we are getting closer to an educated guess if it is a proprietary Kingsong or a general 800W issue...

It could be the PWM-frequency + some harmonics. I'll have to see if I can plug the "naked" Firewheel-mainboard into the motor some day and get readings from the PWM-signal with an oscilloscope (my Rigol has some frequency analyzing capabilities with FFT, but I doubt it will be even nearly as precise as a real spectrum analyzer). I doubt motor wattage has much to do with it, likely the motor wiring/coils or something oscillates with the pulses causing an audible sound.

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dmethvin    1,527

I installed Advanced Spectrum but don't see any peaks on my Firewheel graph. Not sure where Jason's phone was in relation to the wheel, I was leaning down and holding the phone near the wheel while accelerating and decelerating. The only sound I hear is the "whine" that changes frequency with the speed of the wheel. There is no sound at all from the wheel when it's stopped.

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Jason McNeil    3,147
31 minutes ago, dmethvin said:

There is no sound at all from the wheel when it's stopped.

Might be a KS/GW phenomenon with the 800W class of motor: the whine is pretty discernible

.  

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