Jug Posted June 4, 2016 Author Share Posted June 4, 2016 Thanks @Jason McNeil for help, so it is best to buy the same cells samsung 30Q! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason McNeil Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 Yeah, those cells are phenomenal! In the ideal world there should be a mfg law requiring all 16 cell Wheels (Airwheel x3/X8 & IPS a130s (mine do ) ) to contain >10-15A cells like the 30Q & HG2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esaj Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 It certainly isn't a good idea to mix different cells in the same pack (it might work just ok, but if the internal resistances or capacities are very different, it's going to affect the currents & voltages of single cells, in the worst case causing cell damage & reversal). As for paralleling packs of different capacities, it should work, although again, if the capacities and internal resistances are different, the charging & discharging currents will divide unevenly, causing more stress on some pack(s). AFAIK, the original 820Wh -version of MSuper V2 has actually 2 x 16S2P (2 x 174Wh each) + 1 x 16S1P (132Wh) -packs, which used different cells (2200mAh for the single 16S1P and 2900mAh for the 16S2P's)? Apparently at least those have worked fine... But probably the safest bet is to use the same cells for all packs. Although, I think Hobby16 once said that paralleling packs of different capacities should be ok... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josefg Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 Hello, I´m going to receive a used Gotway Mcm4 v2 hs 260 WH. As far as I know, it has a 1x 16S2P Sony 10A 2200mAh (3.7V x 2.2 Watt x 32 = 260 WH). I want to upgrade it as soon as posible so, should I buy another 16S2P 2200mAh (260Wh) although cells were from different brand? or could I use a 16S2P 2600mAh (308WH)?, or even could I use 2 x 16S1P 2xxx mAh with its BMS each?. I can imagine that using 2x16S1P with 2 BMS i will need to made room for them and use doble Y-connector. Thanks in advance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 16 minutes ago, josefg said: Hello, I´m going to receive a used Gotway Mcm4 v2 hs 260 WH. As far as I know, it has a 1x 16S2P Sony 10A 2200mAh (3.7V x 2.2 Watt x 32 = 260 WH). I want to upgrade it as soon as posible so, should I buy another 16S2P 2200mAh (260Wh) although cells were from different brand? or could I use a 16S2P 2600mAh (308WH)?, or even could I use 2 x 16S1P 2xxx mAh with its BMS each?. I can imagine that using 2x16S1P with 2 BMS i will need to made room for them and use doble Y-connector. Thanks in advance. Its a real Mcm4? or a Mcm4 in Mcm2 shell (aka mcm3)? if real mcm4 it should be (placewise) no problem to insert another 16S2P pack.... If the Pack must be exactly the same 2200mah cells or not depends on your connection method! If you "just" parallel them by y-cable i myself would go for the exact same pack. If you "daisy chain" them...you also can throw in a 416wh(420) 16S2P pack from 3500mah cells. I would not go the 2x16S1P way...as this is -place and weightwise- just a BMS to much, which is not needed.... But as you see: There are no "easy" answers....and you should know what you are doing!!! especially paralleling packs! They need to be on the same voltage, before connecting!!! Otherwise: BOOM ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josefg Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 2 hours ago, KingSong69 said: Its a real Mcm4? or a Mcm4 in Mcm2 shell (aka mcm3)? if real mcm4 it should be (placewise) no problem to insert another 16S2P pack.... If the Pack must be exactly the same 2200mah cells or not depends on your connection method! If you "just" parallel them by y-cable i myself would go for the exact same pack. If you "daisy chain" them...you also can throw in a 416wh(420) 16S2P pack from 3500mah cells. I would not go the 2x16S1P way...as this is -place and weightwise- just a BMS to much, which is not needed.... But as you see: There are no "easy" answers....and you should know what you are doing!!! especially paralleling packs! They need to be on the same voltage, before connecting!!! Otherwise: BOOM ;-) Yes, It's real Mcm4. Well, i'm trying to find the batteries in China and there is a difference in price. For a 16S2P pack 175 $: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/60v-unicycle-battery-pack-60v-4-4Ah-350w-4400mah-for-brand-18650-cell-li-ion-battery/32767470520.html?spm=2114.01010208.3.315.KCoQFi&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_3_10152_10065_10151_10068_10136_10137_10060_10155_10062_437_10154_10056_10055_10054_10059_303_100031_10099_10103_10102_10096_10052_10053_10142_10107_10050_10051_5030016_10084_10083_10080_10082_10081_10110_519_10111_10176_10112_10113_10114_10182_10184_10078_10079_10073_10123_10189_142,searchweb201603_16,ppcSwitch_5&btsid=6fafeb3f-491a-475e-a747-51aab65a56b6&algo_expid=8dd55af7-cb49-45d3-be8d-624eb64a826f-44&algo_pvid=8dd55af7-cb49-45d3-be8d-624eb64a826f For a 16S1P pack 42,8$: https://es.aliexpress.com/item/Z015-59-2V-60V-132WH-2200mAh-18650-16pcs-67-2V-charge-Li-ion-rechargeable-battery/32779792220.html?spm=2114.01010208.0.0.KCoQFi On one hand it´s cheaper 2x 16S1P, and with two BMS it will be more protective but on the other hand I don´t know if i will have problems with charging timing with three packs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 1 hour ago, josefg said: Yes, It's real Mcm4. Well, i'm trying to find the batteries in China and there is a difference in price. For a 16S2P pack 175 $: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/60v-unicycle-battery-pack-60v-4-4Ah-350w-4400mah-for-brand-18650-cell-li-ion-battery/32767470520.html?spm=2114.01010208.3.315.KCoQFi&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_3_10152_10065_10151_10068_10136_10137_10060_10155_10062_437_10154_10056_10055_10054_10059_303_100031_10099_10103_10102_10096_10052_10053_10142_10107_10050_10051_5030016_10084_10083_10080_10082_10081_10110_519_10111_10176_10112_10113_10114_10182_10184_10078_10079_10073_10123_10189_142,searchweb201603_16,ppcSwitch_5&btsid=6fafeb3f-491a-475e-a747-51aab65a56b6&algo_expid=8dd55af7-cb49-45d3-be8d-624eb64a826f-44&algo_pvid=8dd55af7-cb49-45d3-be8d-624eb64a826f For a 16S1P pack 42,8$: https://es.aliexpress.com/item/Z015-59-2V-60V-132WH-2200mAh-18650-16pcs-67-2V-charge-Li-ion-rechargeable-battery/32779792220.html?spm=2114.01010208.0.0.KCoQFi On one hand it´s cheaper 2x 16S1P, and with two BMS it will be more protective but on the other hand I don´t know if i will have problems with charging timing with three packs. on the next hand you will not know if this cheaper (or the expensive also) cells are just a knockoff-fake cells are a common thing here?! I can only warn to parallel such unknown source batteries, unknown BMS into your wheel. You know...BMS is not just BMS...we need special arrangements on our BMS's , to throw in a BMS that does not do the same as that what GW plans...can have catastrophic failure! And (really no offense meant) you dont seam to have that much of a knowledge of what is going on in your EUC/BMS etc....and how to do it properly without safety issues.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josefg Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 27 minutes ago, KingSong69 said: on the next hand you will not know if this cheaper (or the expensive also) cells are just a knockoff-fake cells are a common thing here?! I can only warn to parallel such unknown source batteries, unknown BMS into your wheel. You know...BMS is not just BMS...we need special arrangements on our BMS's , to throw in a BMS that does not do the same as that what GW plans...can have catastrophic failure! And (really no offense meant) you dont seam to have that much of a knowledge of what is going on in your EUC/BMS etc....and how to do it properly without safety issues.... You're right. I'm trying to learn. The key question is, can I purchase the original battery of 260 wh from Gotway in the European Union?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 2 minutes ago, josefg said: You're right. I'm trying to learn. The key question is, can I purchase the original battery of 260 wh from Gotway in the European Union?. You can...or get at least a perfectly builded pack with the correct BMS and up to 420wh! 1radwerkstatt.de is the right adress for such upgrades....highest reputation.....but attention, this is not nearly as cheap as this chinese packs! other way would be to ask GW where to go to get a 260wh pack! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US69 Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 On 4.6.2016 at 9:09 PM, esaj said: It certainly isn't a good idea to mix different cells in the same pack (it might work just ok, but if the internal resistances or capacities are very different, it's going to affect the currents & voltages of single cells, in the worst case causing cell damage & reversal). As for paralleling packs of different capacities, it should work, although again, if the capacities and internal resistances are different, the charging & discharging currents will divide unevenly, causing more stress on some pack(s). AFAIK, the original 820Wh -version of MSuper V2 has actually 2 x 16S2P (2 x 174Wh each) + 1 x 16S1P (132Wh) -packs, which used different cells (2200mAh for the single 16S1P and 2900mAh for the 16S2P's)? Apparently at least those have worked fine... But probably the safest bet is to use the same cells for all packs. Although, I think Hobby16 once said that paralleling packs of different capacities should be ok... Just as this is often discussed... 1radwerkstatt offers his wheels very often in a 340 + 414 config, or the ks18 in a 680 + 828=1508 configuration... From vaping experiences, it is known that it is not good to parallel a 2200mah cell with a 2900mah cell. The difference to EUC's is: we are paralleling complete packs, each one saved and secured by a BMS. Also, in KS configs the packs are "daisy chained"..... Personally, my V3 is running with a "complete" 820wh pack/one BMS, which is daisy chained by/from a 340wh/one BMS pack.... So here we have a extrem ...340wh and 820wh, and that was all configured and done under the neat advice by Chris from 1radwerkstatt, and it is easy for me to say: When they have a advice batteriewise, for me its no problem to follow :-) Btw.: the original big Msuper V2 was 850wh, not 820 :-) the put a 1 x 170wh extra pack to the normal of the 2x340wh....so no different cell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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