Ninebot one advance BMS and repair workshop (shut down problem)

[mumtaz]

Hey there fellas,

Got this ninebot one e+ a couple months ago directly form the company, had my fair share of experience and fallen love with it. 

Until it got broken of course, all sudden the board caught up on flame and stopped working eventually. 

The company was nice enough to replace the parts at no cost which they did. 

After a quick install and registering the new S/N it was even better than before with new 1.2.7 firmware update.

However after couple of days it just shut down by itself suddenly while going with 5-6 km on a straight road. 

No burns or visual irregularities  on board and control board. So I suspect I could fix it with BMS shunting molfset mod as the company refused a 2nd replacement. 

I will throw some photos here which hope can draw your attention and help me out with how I should do this.

Right now the power is not coming on, arching when connecting to charger ı understand this is typical BMS shutdown from checking with volt meters on board and bms.

I would appreciate some help during this journey and I will make sure to keep updating with details and pictures.

 

Yes I have gone to forbidden place and discovered the motor! then I have assembled and rode the device with no problem 

[mumtaz]

And here's what I plan to do: 

I will shunt the below red pointed molsfet which I understand that it will bypass the secuirty protocol of BMS   bms(0).bmp 

that is causing to shut down the power to protect the Main board.

What do you think, I seen some BMS mods where direct connection with a cable is available too. 

 

 

 

bms(0).bmp

[Chriull]

Hey there fellas,

Got this ninebot one e+ a couple months ago directly form the company, had my fair share of experience and fallen love with it. 

Until it got broken of course, all sudden the board caught up on flame and stopped working eventually. 

The company was nice enough to replace the parts at no cost which they did. 

After a quick install and registering the new S/N it was even better than before with new 1.2.7 firmware update.

Did you have one with a S/N starting with N10 and the new S/N starting with N20? What was better?

Excuse my curiosity

However after couple of days it just shut down by itself suddenly while going with 5-6 km on a straight road. 

No burns or visual irregularities  on board and control board. So I suspect I could fix it with BMS shunting molfset mod as the company refused a 2nd replacement. 

I will throw some photos here which hope can draw your attention and help me out with how I should do this.

Right now the power is not coming on, arching when connecting to charger ı understand this is typical BMS shutdown from checking with volt meters on board and bms.

After connecting to the charger you could power the ninebot on again? (If not it was not the BMS shutdown...)

(Btw.: If it is the BMS shutdown you can get the EUC up and running again by disconnecting and reconnecting the batteries as well...)

And here's what I plan to do: 

I will shunt the below red pointed molsfet which I understand that it will bypass the secuirty protocol of BMS   bms(0).bmp 

that is causing to shut down the power to protect the Main board.

What do you think, I seen some BMS mods where direct connection with a cable is available too. 

Seems like you made the red spots at the right places. It's strange, that it looks as there is a connection between pin 3 of the mosfets (rightmost) and the big solder blob V2 (which is a battery connection?) - which should not be at all!! But it's not really to be seen clearly on the foto.

For the BMS mod with a cable connection  you need to look again on the PCB:

One point could be V1 (named B- by hobby16 in his schematics). This point should have a connection on the PCB with pin 2 (middle leg) of the 3 rightmost MOSFETS.

The second point (named P- by hobby16 in his schematics) should be where a fat black cable is attached, which leads to the mother board. This point has to have a PCB connection to the lower part of the 4 resistors in parallel in the lower right corner of the BMS PCB (the upper part of the resistors is connected on the PCB with pin 3 (rightmost leg) of the MOSFETS.)

Ps.: if you shunt the Mosfets where you made the red points you can use a piece of cable which you solder between the legs - then you won't get such big fat ugly blobs of solder between the legs....

[jayjay23]

The problem you described sounded first like the 1.2.6 problem (http://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/1390-ninebot-one-do-not-update-to-126-firmware/), but you say you have 1.2.7.

 

[mumtaz]

Dear @Chriull:

thank you so much for your input, answer to your queztion as per below n10 was old and n20 was the new S/N and it was far better stable and faster then old one.

After I plug the charge nothing happens no power but little arching between the charge port and the charger. we actually check the board no power comes on but when we check with electro meter the battery works fine sends electricity to board but board shutsdown the operation, thats how ı thought it was BMS problem when reconnect batteries nothing also happens but a little arch between the ports. 

thank you for going in detail explaining the bms schema I understand you are not familiar specificly with ninebots? as I am not really good expert with electronics, I am looking for someone to actually nice enough to draw on a bms for me to apply here.

I will post below the picture of BMS in more detail if you can work on it, anything else I can provide?

Like I sad as there is no smoke or visual damage, I have a strong belief that ı could have this thing fixed.

Ninebot company refuses to replace the part second time as they say this should have not happened. 

They were pretty responsive to first replacement request so I cant really blame them here...

 

I will post some more pictures later today

Thanks

Did you have one with a S/N starting with N10 and the new S/N starting with N20? What was better?

Excuse my curiosity

After connecting to the charger you could power the ninebot on again? (If not it was not the BMS shutdown...)

(Btw.: If it is the BMS shutdown you can get the EUC up and running again by disconnecting and reconnecting the batteries as well...)

Seems like you made the red spots at the right places. It's strange, that it looks as there is a connection between pin 3 of the mosfets (rightmost) and the big solder blob V2 (which is a battery connection?) - which should not be at all!! But it's not really to be seen clearly on the foto.

For the BMS mod with a cable connection  you need to look again on the PCB:

One point could be V1 (named B- by hobby16 in his schematics). This point should have a connection on the PCB with pin 2 (middle leg) of the 3 rightmost MOSFETS.

The second point (named P- by hobby16 in his schematics) should be where a fat black cable is attached, which leads to the mother board. This point has to have a PCB connection to the lower part of the 4 resistors in parallel in the lower right corner of the BMS PCB (the upper part of the resistors is connected on the PCB with pin 3 (rightmost leg) of the MOSFETS.)

Ps.: if you shunt the Mosfets where you made the red points you can use a piece of cable which you solder between the legs - then you won't get such big fat ugly blobs of solder between the legs....

 

Dear @Chriull:

thank you so much for your input, answer to your queztion as per below n10 was old and n20 was the new S/N and it was far better stable and faster then old one.

After I plug the charge nothing happens no power but little arching between the charge port and the charger. we actually check the board no power comes on but when we check with electro meter the battery works fine sends electricity to board but board shutsdown the operation, thats how ı thought it was BMS problem when reconnect batteries nothing also happens but a little arch between the ports. 

thank you for going in detail explaining the bms schema I understand you are not familiar specificly with ninebots? as I am not really good expert with electronics, I am looking for someone to actually nice enough to draw on a bms for me to apply here.

I will post below the picture of BMS in more detail if you can work on it, anything else I can provide?

Like I sad as there is no smoke or visual damage, I have a strong belief that ı could have this thing fixed.

Ninebot company refuses to replace the part second time as they say this should have not happened. 

They were pretty responsive to first replacement request so I cant really blame them here...

 

I will post some more pictures later today

Thanks

 

The problem you described sounded first like the 1.2.6 problem (http://forum.electricunicycle.org/topic/1390-ninebot-one-do-not-update-to-126-firmware/), but you say you have 1.2.7.

 

Yes my friend ı have went thru that forum... right after the update this happened like a day later, I actually was told to make sure ı ugot updated by the company , wish i did not now. 

[Chriull]

...After I plug the charge nothing happens no power but little arching between the charge port and the charger. we actually check the board no power comes on but when we check with electro meter the battery works fine sends electricity to board but board shutsdown the operation, thats how ı thought it was BMS problem when reconnect batteries nothing also happens but a little arch between the ports. 

That's bad - looks like the mainboard is dead again and shunting the BMS will not change anything.

thank you for going in detail explaining the bms schema I understand you are not familiar specificly with ninebots? as I am not really good expert with electronics, I am looking for someone to actually nice enough to draw on a bms for me to apply here.

I will post below the picture of BMS in more detail if you can work on it, anything else I can provide?

I am sorry - not really anything i could think of... I would guess your Motherboard is dead, your BMS is fine and the problem lies somewhere else...

Like I sad as there is no smoke or visual damage, I have a strong belief that ı could have this thing fixed.

Ninebot company refuses to replace the part second time as they say this should have not happened. 

They were pretty responsive to first replacement request so I cant really blame them here...

The first board catched fire, you exchanged it and now the second board is dead. So there presumably is something wrong with the motor and/or the cabling. So i would blame the Ninebot company, because they did not fix the cause - changing the Motherboard was nice but was absolutely useless as we know by now.

[mumtaz]

That's bad - looks like the mainboard is dead again and shunting the BMS will not change anything.

I am sorry - not really anything i could think of... I would guess your Motherboard is dead, your BMS is fine and the problem lies somewhere else...

The first board catched fire, you exchanged it and now the second board is dead. So there presumably is something wrong with the motor and/or the cabling. So i would blame the Ninebot company, because they did not fix the cause - changing the Motherboard was nice but was absolutely useless as we know by now.

Dear Churill, thank you for your input. I agree its little messed up with the company, I am not sure if I should push them to change the whole unit. He also mentioned that after the next replacement byu me if same thing happens they will change the unit for free..  So I think I better off find myself a new mainboard this time for the nb1. I will thro clos up pics of BMS if someone can think of anything else.. what about replacing molfset on main board or bms? 

[Chriull]

Dear Churill, thank you for your input. I agree its little messed up with the company, I am not sure if I should push them to change the whole unit. He also mentioned that after the next replacement byu me if same thing happens they will change the unit for free..  So I think I better off find myself a new mainboard this time for the nb1. I will thro clos up pics of BMS if someone can think of anything else.. what about replacing molfseton main board or bms? 

 

If you find a new mainboard for your nb i assume it will be dead after a short while again - you did not remove the cause that killed your first two mainboards...

Replacing the Mosfets should not help either, the MOSFETS of the mainboard maybe died - but thats again the symptom and not the cause...

Maybe your motor is out of specs or something causes overload/short circuit from time to time and kills your mainboard. So messing around with the BMS or mainboard are maybe fun will not help you if you cannot locate the real problem...

[mumtaz]

Dear Friends, 

I just wanted to update you on this, I have started to look up a new main board. I am also looking in to other possible solutions with try/fail method:) and as I tried to connect the battery to device, I see a spark arching instantly and every time. Anybody know why this is happening? 

Thanks

[cbgti]

@mumtaz : any news?

I want to know : Ninebot just sent you a new motherboard (without you sent them your 9B1) ?
And to be sure, they give to you a 2nd motherboard with another serial number? You have a N10 bot and now, your second motherboard (died now) has a N20 serial number?

Then your maximum speed (with the N20 motherboard/serial) was increased after updating the firmware in 1.2.7 ?

[Viktiga]

On 2015-10-23 09:29:30, mumtaz said:

thank you so much for your input, answer to your queztion as per below n10 was old and n20 was the new S/N and it was far better stable and faster then old one.

The n10 serial number is a dummy number, I got the same one for my replace board.

[Tishawn Fahie]

Hello was wondering is it beneficial to shunt a Ninebot One P? I haven't experience any cutoffs but but hearing about them from others makes me wonder....If so @Mumtaz or anyone can answer where you put those 2 red dots are those the correct points to bridge? Any informations would be appreciated it?

[Bert08]

Hey everyone. Not sure if this is the right place, as I'm a way less electric-savvy rider, but I may need your help.

I'm looking for a new charger for my Ninebot One E+ (same as the OP). A plain original-like one would suffice for me as I'm completely charger-less right now (original charger burnt) and I don't feel comfortable going "off-road", charging speaking.

Is there anywhere I can find a compatible charger for my EUC? Maybe not at 100€ and super hard to find as the original one?

Thank you and sorry if this wasn't the right place for this question!

[zlymex]

First time see this. Looks to me that the battery pack/BMS is missing the balancing part. I believe I saw another E+ model with missing balancing components too.